all i can say is gl
^^

Nice

nice indeed

no download link? nm it wasnt approved yet when i posted that..

i'm stupid and don't know how to check if the program is valid...
so i'll wait for therogue to test it out

mama rosa ftw!

attached it as misc file as it is hardly an image ;p
you can select the file type in a pull-down menu when uploading.

WOw, good stuff Raziel. As you may have seen I made a thread about this here http://forums.thecpl.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?u...0;t=000364
Seems like your program should now meet what was originally a fairly weak excuse not to use it in the first place.

Don't hold your breath though, Razer are a sponsor of the CPL and this program renders their latest copperhead devices obsolete, because it's only the polling rate which , made the G5 and Copperhead smooth in the first place. And possibly worthy of an upgrade, or not when you consider both the G5 and Copperhead have their faults.
Hopefully this means I can go back to my Mx510 and get a 60 quid refund on my G5.

i dont think they will give you a refund after you put holes in it and taken half the insides out.

Slap it on Ebay, who knows, maybe it'll sell.

wtf? you bought a new mouse because of the polling rate? dood, like, I aim better on my old ball mouse than my optical mouse (but turning very fast becomes a bitch) 1ms is not going to make you aim better. Buy a mouse that works, not one with gadgets.

rape!

Yeh I went back to my 510 and it's miles better:(
And it's light cuz it got drilled!

I think there is a certain danger with the 1000hz setting and realtime applying of that. I tried it just to see if my PC supports it (a not so old Asus A8V Deluxe Mainboard, it didn't) and soon found my PC to not be responding to my input (mouse and keyboard, both usb). Since alot of people will not have a mainboard that supports it, I would maybe implement a confirmation setting for the 1000hz patch with a big warning, and regarding CPL I would check if the mainboards they use, support the patch (and if it's not only a mainboard but also a mouse/keyboard issue, then maybe you should leave out that option all along in ordner to not cause any problems for the tournament supervisors).

Yeh it should be noted that (as far as I know) that each time you increase polling rate 250, 500, 750,1000hz it eats up into the CPU and also can play havoc with your USB devices. Personally I think this program should locked at 500 Hz. I blew my mx518 when experimenting with 1000hz.

The logitechs cannot hold more than 500 hz anyway.

My MSWMO 1.1a achieves 999hz perfectly. Yet another strange thing about new mice is how they can't handle high polling :/

good to know. i was kinda scared to bump it that high.

I use 125hz anyway :x

my ms mouse has been running at 750mhz for the past month, no problems, I only paid £15 for it too!

I really hope that tournament organisers accept this as they have mouse drivers. Good work.

gj Raziel!

After I read a comment by you on crossfire (stating that you're working on this program) I thought you would even include some more mousetweaks (e.g. the (mouse)tweaks of your program 'The Damned'). Anything planned like this or does CPL 'only' want a USB polling rate switcher?

thanks :)
I have been busy making a tweaking program for windows, which contains almost everything you would ever need.
However, for this application I wanted to keep the task at hand isolated, in case I have to fix possible problems. And reach a final version as fast as possible.
Once it's determined it can be used on most systems, I will add more features. Which also depends on what CPL and gamer community want.

Nice, keep it up then :)

Nice job Raz :) Can i post it on xfire?

be my guest. spread it as much as possible ;)

don't really know if it works for my copperhead

on starting it the 1st time: 125hz it says
then i checked Mouserate (which reports 500hz) and DIMouseHz (which reports 1000hz)...

upon changing it to 250hz (or other rates), no changes in either Mouserate of DIMouseHz

Why do you want to use it with a Copperhead? Thought it's using 1000Hz native?

you can tell the firmware to use 1000hz with the Razer Configurator, i just wanted to test if this program correctly reads the rate it's working at right now

Mouserate reports this wrong (500hz), but it's doing 1000hz (according to DIMouseHz and the Configurator itself)

Ahh, now I understand ;)

Wait for Raziel. He should know his program best ;(

simply because the copperhead is a high-speed usb device. and can tell XP directly through it's hardware which samplerate it wants. common high-speed usb devices are removable storage devices. the method these new mice are using, is still not 100% controllable and not providing the wanted result yet. early firmware versions in the copperhead couldn't provide more than 360 inputs per second, when set to 500Hz.

mouserate programs just providing a measure for interval between inputs are awful that way. counting the exact amount of inputs per second is a lot more important, as well as less confusing for most people not knowing what's going on.

my patches are ment for low-speed usb devices, which all other mice are.
Using my program to change samplerate won't affect high-speed usb devices at all. It's up to the companies making their mice support both.

thanks ;)

Doesn't seem to work on 2K for me :/

XP only atm

why not make if for 2k since all 2k-programs work in xp too?

The file it edits is different in 2k. Of course this only means he has to find the file in 2k and have it auto detect the OS etc.

hm...why i cant feel a difference? :D think im just way too slow :>

nice job, well done RaZiel !

so does anyone know what happens to your ipod if you change this to 500-1000hz and its plugged in? :)

It blows up

Dont use it on 1000hz if you dont know much about this stuff, 500hz should be all fine, i have connected several flash drives(well it's not the same as iPod but...), scanners, printers, bluetooth usb dongles etc. It all have worked just fine. Besides 1000hz uses alot of CPU afaik, and most new mice are not able to get them...

How would I know, I use firewire with mine. Buahahaha

ive not had my ipod plugged in when i switched it but have used it with it set to 500hz and no problem.

i refuse to play around with these since one claimed my i.e 30.

rip sweet mouse :)

same. although changing wire e.g. from a ms4.0 fixed it :O

fo shizzle ma nizzle?

is that hard to do?

:)

no lol. just open mouse unplug wire, get new wire plug in, close :))

works great on my db plasma when changing the polling rate in realtime to 250hz and 500hz. i didn't try any higher. i think i'll take this little tool to all the lans i go. i'm already satisfied with it. very good job.

iv changed it to 250 last night tho one problem occurd i coulnd move my mouse anymore so i reboot
but after the reboot it works fine i use a semi slow sens and it feels beter ingame with 250 hz

that's normal operation. your mouse is supposed to stop moving once you click the "apply" button. the time it takes until it starts moving again is different from one system to another, depending on what chipset and how many usb host controllers the system has. on my computer it takes about 30 seconds, but I've seen other computers just using 5-10 seconds.
if you're using the windows sounds, you'll hear the usb disconnect and connect sounds indicating this.

please try to use it again, wait and see if the light source inside the mouse turns back on. vital information to know how it works on all hardware setups.

I used this yesterday, and my mouse totaly died.. The light went out when I clicked apply, and it didn't switch back on. So, reboot. Still nothing, checked the light, which was on. But the mouse was dead, totaly dead. Tried my wacom, dead too. so, after alot of tabbing and stuff I managed to get it back to 125hz, klicked apply, it says "ok" and all, but the mouse was still dead.

then I noticed there was some window telling me that some files had been changed to "non authentic drivers" or some shit like that. said it wanted some disc, I figured it was the xp disc, but no.

So, I had to reinstall XP for my mouse to work again. Which it did, and so did the wacom (phew).

There must have been some major bug that caused this (duh). But I don't really understand what. I'd used another usbrate program before this one, changed it to 500, and then back to 125 (aim went to hell).

Anyhow. Mouse is a mx 300, winxp pro sp1, dunno if you need some other info from me. But I guess you don't want this to happen to anyone else.

Don't know if I dare try it again, but perhaps I will. I'll let you know how it goes if I do.

That program killed my windows (win2k) and while crashing took my 250gb mp3-hdd with it... Good job!
Same thing happened to a clanmate of mine with his winxp - we both had to re-install everything. It's definitely not the 500hz which caused it because we both used that in the past.

Windows is such a whiny bitch. The program changes a .sys file and windows gets all moody and refuses to do anything. You're ment to say no to every dialog windows pops up until it learns the lesson and starts co-operating again.

yeah, I usually do that :D

but this time it didn't work at all :(

I used this yesterday, and my mouse totaly died.. The light went out when I clicked apply, and it didn't switch back on. So, reboot. Still nothing, checked the light, which was on. But the mouse was dead, totaly dead. Tried my wacom, dead too. so, after alot of tabbing and stuff I managed to get it back to 125hz, klicked apply, it says "ok" and all, but the mouse was still dead.

This is likely to happen with custom versions of the systemfile being patched, which (not very common) is supplied by chipset drivers. For example VIA is known to have it's own versions because of various major problems with their chipsets using USB in the past. But usually it's never installed on the pc without the user having to select that option.

Your wacom is a low-speed usb device too. Also depending on the same systemfile that was patched, and failed. Once the systemfile is fully functional, all devices depending on it will work again. Formatting is always the last resort, but fully understandable if you don't know how to fix possible problems.

I'll make sure I'll add some security measures in the next version, and solve the issue with uncommon systemfiles being used.
And you can always connect your mouse to the PS2 connection if you can't navigate through XP to fix possible problems via the keyboard.

It would be helpful also if you open the application and tell me what it says in "FileVersion". Nothing changes on your pc when opening and closing the program

then I noticed there was some window telling me that some files had been changed to "non authentic drivers" or some shit like that. said it wanted some disc, I figured it was the xp disc, but no.

Windows with "non authentic drivers" popping up is just XP's way of telling the user a change has been made to one of it's systemfiles. You may close these, if you want to keep the patched systemfile.

In zealot's case; it's not for win2k. Win2k and XP is totally different when it comes to changing samplerate as well. I won't support win2k, unless CPL and other major events will start using it again.
The reason for your 250mb mp3 device to fail, as with dubcat's wacom, they are low-speed usb devices, they all use the same systemfile. Which is common for older mp3 players, and storage devices(usbsticks) with fairly small capacity.

Most storage devices with large capacity (1gb and up) are detected as high-speed usb devices (hence their support for using more bandwidth), should never take use of the same systemfile this application is patching, and remain unaffected by the increased samplerate.

To make sure people aren't afraid to try the application, please avoid saying something "died" or got "killed". Which may imply hardware getting broken beyond repair. I've yet to see any hardware actually get broken by increasing the samplerate. If someone says otherwise, I hope they would provide all information possible to find the cause.

When it doesn't work, it's simply because the software can't communicate
properly with the hardware. Which may happen, since there's a lot of different software and hardware combinations used on personal computers. Using XP with SP2 is what I recommend so far, haven't heard any problems at all from users patching such systems.
Thanks for your input :)

allright. I had installed a usb patch that came with my motherboard (via chipset), so it's probarbly like you said. the via driver didn't like that software. it'd be good to know this in a final version readme or something like that.

and just so that you know, I didn't really mean this as something very negative or as some sort of attack towards your program. things like these happen when you install betas, and I usually fix it straight away when it does. I just told you what happened and that I didn't know how to fix that problem. and no worries really, I just reinstalled winxp, didn't do any formating. so nothing was lost for me. and everything is fine now.

but, the weird thing is that I can change the usb rate with another program, but not with yours.

and the file is the same as I downloaded here.

Yeh, I'll include some sort of FAQ or readme. No worries, I didn't read it as any negative at all :) Just trying to avoid situations with people connecting unrelated problems with this program. Which does happen quite a lot in the computer world :(

If you can tell me what FileVersion my application reports on your system, I'll be able to fix that problem quite fast. A quick fix for you, but not helping me though, would be to upgrade to SP2.

found the problem, and will have an updated version ready soon. it was the non-sp2 code. sorry for the trouble it caused. as thanks I'll add you to the credits as a beta-tester for the helpful feedback :)

<3

that's nice. good luck with the program!

No, my 250GB hdd (not usb) just died. GB!=MB
My mate got winXP so somethings wrong besides my windows :>

oops. read mp3 after the gb, somehow my brain interpreted it as mb :P
yeh, his problem might be similar to dubcat's. What XP version is he using? might be as simple as my non-SP2 code being broken, since it's entirely coded in SP2. I'll install all XP's versions myself to make sure all features work

Not sure what was up with his winxp was well annoying though.
Still keep up the work cos 500hz@cpl would be nice :)

doesnt q4 hate a polling rate higher than 125hz??

Nope, I have no problem. Maybe its just the new mice that start acting funny when they get together with Q4.

do you notice any difference in q4 changing the rate? I mean with the 60fps cap I think it would be like using a bazooka for fishing

every time a game is about to draw a frame, it will ask for the most recent position of the mouse, to calulate the relative movement since the last frame. with increased samplerate this position will be closer to realtime, hence increasing the feeling of responsiveness.

as long as fps is less than Hz there won't be any duplicated mouse positions, unless the mouse can't detect a change (for example when it's standing still). so this means increased samplerate is always favourable, no matter the fps cap.

Isn't it kinda useless to have a 500MHz USB rate when Q4 is only running at 12fps?

How is this different then Anir's mousrate switcher? Does it allow for single USB changing? What are some of the differences and what does it offer different then some of the other programs?

His and others are using my USB patches. So the method of increasing the samplerate is not different at all. The way of applying them in windows , is what's different.
Instead of manually hexedit the systemfile, these programs do that for the user by standard Win32 file routines. There's nothing more to them. Most of them require you to be in safe-mode, to avoid Windows File Protection(WFP). None, as far I know have been successful at patching the system without requiring a reboot.

Mine does all that, but also meets CPL requirements of reading current Hz set in that systemfile and being able to avoid WFP without being in safe-mode, nor requiring any reboot to use the patched file.
I didn't want to provide a simple GUI program like the others, because people were too lazy to use a hexeditor :P

Hmm... Do not talk about "So the method of increasing the
samplerate is not different at all." There are exists one right method - the writing of filter driver. Which Strider and I applied in practice. The result is working from Win98 to WinXP x64, overclock per one device only (not touching other USB lowspeed devices) and allow on-the-fly rate change. And thank to the Strider's idea - now no one system files was patched under WinXP even.

More:
http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=905398#pid905307
http://sweetlow.at.tut.by/download/hidusbf.zip

You late (little) with your program :)
But thank you - for the idea of USB mouse overcklocking itself.

We were talking about XP, and the programs built around my patches. Usbrate is made for XP mainly, because it's the OS they use at major lans.

"one right method"; give me a break. According to whom?
Good you're following Microsoft's policy of adding to the system, instead of replacing... More drivers - more use of resources. Now, why would that be more "right" than changing the samplerate at it's root?
Why boast about per device control, when it's clearly not really needed? Especially not in the context of gaming.

On the contrary. As I stated, I waited until the right moment. Most LAN events and gamingcenters of today are already using my program.
NP - but thank you for such a nice attitude and PR.

>As I stated, I waited until the right moment. Most LAN events
and gamingcenters of today are already using my program.<

As you wish... The writing of code is interesting, the support - is not.

It may be a stupid question but does it work with windows xp x64?

i have a question. does this affect all usb ports or only the one the mouse is connected to? my mouse runs fine at 500hz but some other stuff like my phone's USB cable doesnt.. thankfully the actual switching works as expected so i go back to 125hz when i'm done gaming.

It affects all ports :)

Ok... err some questions :o

Is this worth installing? What exacly does it do, does it give you more "responsiveness"?
I read something in the posts about 1000Hz stressing out the CPU, is this the case with 250/500Hz aswell?
Will it eat a lot of CPU power? My p4 2.6 might not like it! :P
And if I would use it, what's a good rate for my Mx518?
Should I worry about other USB devices in the future if I used this program?

:D

Important questions. I will fill in some "help" or "FAQ" button in the next version to cover most questions and/or issues that can appear. Will be released this evening or tomorrow. (psst. yes, it's worth it)

:D

CUBAN0^^:
i was working with 500 hz , but now i put 1000, with a mx500 and work well, not problems, and not errors with win xp.

MX500 is just as happy as any intellimouse to hand out enough inputs for 1000hz :) It's simply because they all belong to the old series of mice with 8 bit datapath.

So how comes a 16bit+ cannot give out enough?

larger inputs. even mx510 with 12bit suffers from it.

It actually works! Extremely cool. :)

any word from CPL yet RaZiel?

for some reason, when i try setting it to 500 hz it doesn't take effect until i reboot even if it set to real time.

how does this program effect other usb devices like keyboards, cameras using ilink to transfer pictures, pda/cell phone sycronisation devices, etc?

Best advice is to not use it with lots of other devices. A usb keyboard/mice and it should be fine (What I have here and on my older pc)

so your advice is to limit the functionality of the computer by not hooking up things that you might need, well that's not good

If he wants to use this without compromising the possible damage to those items then yes.

Nice one, this will definitelly replace the current usb rate switcher wich needs to reboot in safe mode. I've got a small issue here, and I think I found the cause already :
When I first used it, it my mouse/keyboard stopped answering (I waited 1 whole minute), I had to shutdown and then start again my pc to get them back (and then they were working @ the rate I picked up in the program).
For testing purpose, I disabled the hyperthreading (wich I know can cause trouble in a few apps) of my p4c in bios and rebooted... and then it just worked perfectly, I could change the rate directly!
Here are the main specs of my system, hope it will help you to fix that small bug :
p4p800, p4c 2.6 with ht (overclocked with unsynchronized ram) and gf6600gt agp.
I'm also using accelfix.exe (wich modifies win32k.sys to bypass the mousecurve shit or something)
I guess you don't need more details, but if you do just leave a word here :-).

can anyone tell me if it will work in my G5?

hmm, what about winxp 64bit, it doesnt work on 64:(:(:(

imo those things are nice but really, it shouldn't be necessairy... what we need are mice that already have those kind of upgrades implemented.

yeah, this program is good, but will i risk damaging my iPod, my digital camera or my printer to make my mouse movements smoother? i don't think so

if you read the faq, you'll see that it's only certain lowspeed usb decives that uses the modified .sys file. I highly doubt your ipod does though you better ask raziel ^^. This begs a question, is it only USB 1.1 devices that are lowspeed? :o

could someone link me to a good USB changer for Win2000?

I think that there isnt a changer for win2000 yet :(
Im using also win2000 (pro) and im waitning for a changer

Hello!

You can use SweetLow's HIDUSBF: http://www.overclockers.ru/lab/15925.shtml

Can you give us more details about your tool, for example when it will be released, what kind of mouse tweak will it contain? I realy can't wait to see it in action.

This is the best thing I've ever downloaded.

Can this program damage usb-controller?

Yes, it can damage USB devices, but it most likelly won't, especially if you don't set the polling rate past 500Hz.

The beauty of this program is that you can raise the Hz when you play a game, and then set it to default 125Hz when you quit.

There`s very little chance of damage overall. No matter what samplerate you use. Make sure you don`t use anything which writes to an usb device running on low-speed usb, and you`ll be safe. Just use common sense and as few usb devices as possible. But in any case, you can always swap samplerate in realtime as Cheese Thief mentions.
- RaZiel

Thanks alot.
I use 500 hz now and it's so smooth...
My aim is a bit better now...

Hey RaZiel,
why don't u just admit that SweetLow's Program is just the better choice?

His:
- change usb rate up to 1000 Hz, just like yours
- but ONLY changing the rate of the mouse, not other usb devices
- change rate on the fly without restart (and it's just faster than yours ;) )
- it's supporting Win 98 up to Win XP x64

Yours:
- change usb rate up to 1000 Hz, just like his'
- change rate on the fly without restart

Yours not supporting device selection and only works on Win XP.

Your arguments to this:
"Good you're following Microsoft's policy of adding to the system, instead of replacing... More drivers - more use of resources."

oh common, a little driver hurting my system performance? You can't be serious. :) I can't see any performance struggle on my system.

"Why boast about per device control, when it's clearly not really needed? Especially not in the context of gaming."

Well.. you allready gave the answer to this by yourself:
"There`s very little chance of damage overall. No matter what samplerate you use. Make sure you don`t use anything which writes to an usb device running on low-speed usb, and you`ll be safe. Just use common sense and as few usb devices as possible."

Why should I use my common sense when I can use SweetLow's program and don't have to bother about anything else? It's only affecting my mouse and so I can plug in as many other USB devices (even low-speed usb) as I wish?! Context of gaming? I've an old MS Sidewinder standing here.. and nowadays nearly noone uses his PC only for gaming.

You are (as far as I know) the first who had the idea for patching usb rate and made a solution for this. Big Respect for this and nobody wants to deny this. But others (like SweetLow and his partners) just improved your idea which is just good for everyone, isn't it? It's obvious, so just be a fair Player and admit it. :)
Maybe you will improve the patching even more in the future (with usb rate 1.0?). If so, everyone will admit it. But at the moment it's SweetLow's program beeing the better choice. But it seems their promotion is a bit struggling..

so once again, everyone who likes to can download SweetLow's prgram here:

http://sweetlow.at.tut.by/download/hidusbf.zip

sorry for my bad english ;)
smooth

Hello, smooth!

RaZiel` doesn't need to admit anything.

You may prefer HIDUSBF (as do I), but others may favour USBRATE.

In fact, both guys are doing (resp. did) a wonderful job for the "community", so both should be given the credit they deserve.

There is absolutely no need for rivalry between these projects.



- anir

well, you're right anir.

but raziel's Post about HIDUSBF just sounded too negative for my opinion, and some of his arguments were a bit confusing I guess.
but maybe "admit" was the wrong word..

smooth

I think RaZiel's programme (at least in it's current state) has a different aim. As he wrote in the newspost the intention about it was to create a programm that could be used at CPL or LAN-Tourneys in general. And I don't think there will be anything else beside a mouse plugged in at such an event.

But I guess for gamers in general a mix of RaZiel's and SweetLow's progs would be the best:
- easy installation w/o the user needing to copy any files (or patch on his own)
- 'on-the-fly' changing of the usbrate
- rate only affecting the port where the mouse is plugged in

if you only could read properly. it wasn't about "better", it was about "right".
both you and him is trying to correct me, and I simply decline. I reply in the correct manner towards bullshit comments. sorry, if that offends you

wipeout, your right.. I forgot about the different aim of raziel's program. If it's only developed for such events it's just as useful as SweetLow's program. But why then releasing it to the public?

I was just thinking of the big community which also wants to take advantage of such a technique, like you can see in the comments.
Raziel, overtake the CPL and whatever event you want and the millions of public playsers will use SweetLow's Program. :)
You don't need to reply because it's obvious which program is more user friendly.

I didn't want to get any Rivalry going on. For me it would be the best if all would work together but someone seems to be kind of greedy to take all the credits...

smooth

You seem confused. Sweetflow understood the sketch, you need the picture...
It's meant for the general public as well. I'm not interested in anything else than providing a tool for those who don't want to buy a new mouse to switch samplerate. And extend it with what's useful. The reason for the OS support in current version, is quite obvious. It supports what the major part of the community and tournaments use.

But it's quite alarming what you think my motives are. Public users or not, they may use which ever way of acheving higher samplerate they see fit. That's none of my business, nor do I care making it my business.
I don't see another method or program as in competition with my work. If there was any sign of rivalry, it would be created by sweetflow himself, and kept alive by your nitpicking.
"There are exists one right method - the writing of filter driver". Arrogant statement, and obviously very false. It's simply just an alternative method, nothing else. Pros and cons with both, but they are insignificant for general use.

What you interpreted as "too negative for my opinion", was facts about a simple comparison of both methods. You just felt it was negative because you support his, quite natural. You may read up on filter drivers and drivers in general to fully understand it. And please go on with your amusing attempt to recruit more supporters :)

I totally agree that people should work together. And that implies without saying: Everyone should respect everyone elses contributions and ideas, including methods of reaching a goal.

you did compare the methods, I did compare the functionality. You look at it as a coder, I do it as a simple player. Maybe we'll never come together on this one, but..
"I totally agree that people should work together. And that implies without saying: Everyone should respect everyone elses contributions and ideas, including methods of reaching a goal."

Right, I guess everything is said now.

keep up the good work, all of you.

smooth

*bookmark

I get lower sensitivity when I boost the usbrate on my intellimouse3 using winxp sp2.

i can change the rate to 500 but when testing it i still get only 125 max inputs. so whats up with that?

hej raziel, max told me you are master in programming now :), and so it seems, grait application! although i needed a reboot to get my hz round 500.

thx, feels mutch better ingame (q3)

hoi. strange how much time you get when not playing games anymore ;)
an update is around the corner, busy at univ atm :(
- raz

Just used this and tried 1000 HZ on my Microsoft 1.1 SE. Works fine but I chose to revert back to 125 HZ. I had to click on the Apply twice for it to switch back to 125 HZ properly.

First time it would jump from 125 to 2000 to 1000 to 125 to 125 to 1000 etc...

Second time 125 125 125 125 125.

Need update! ;))

Any chance of something like this working on Vista? Is there an alternative app I can use for Vista?

Looking for the same. I've done some googling and I haven't seen anything. I might look in to manually patching, but I don't even know if that file exists in Vista. I did a file search and didn't come up with anything.

this is great. is there any newer version out or is this the final release?

thx cs 1.6 4ever PSYCO M