I see theres something new in the playlist (e.g Deadmau5).

oh and also, let the flames of Q3 fanboys begin!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=50kyqZpSHug

STREAM OF VIDEO

posting this here is suicide :(

NO ITS NOT I LIKE WATCHING LOTS OF DIFFERENT GAMES, BUT HAVING NO STREAM ACTUALLY IS SUICIDE!

My short review: Its pretty much like a jibo's own fragmovie, just with only hitscan weapon usage and in slow motion.

yay, third post of this movie
first in the correct section though ;)

It had already been posted? My bad... I checked in movies/forums/journals and didn't see it :(

deleted the forum post
and the other post was a news (http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1657431)

its alright though cause it should have been a movie post in the first place and you added some infos

Ok, the content it boring, but the creators made the best out of it.
Good syncing, great intro.

6/10

its cs and someone posts it on esr (0)
editing and effects were quite good - excellent for a cs movie - just "quite good" after i've seen all the q3 movies of the last years (6-7)
frags were mostly good although too many rounds where they just stopped ecos - about as skilled as respawnfrags in vq3 (7)
intro was well done although i think too long (7-8)

overall i'll give it a 6/10 aswell

lol 6/10 what a cs fanboy you are

not really, killing an enemy in eco round is way harder then respawn killing in Q3.

haha. how's that?

It's called tactics and you're teammates can help you take the enemy with the gun down.

what Keks said.

how the hell is that hard? every shitty noob can hold some recoil and fire 30 shots in the direction where all 5 enemies without armor or weapons come rushing towards him

then way does these ace kills happen more or less rarely?

just because that happens so easily it happens rarely - rather try to pick off one or two enemies to make them spend more money than just rush

it like ... happens all the time?

once in three matches

that reminds me of the the jibo-movie. is it out? did i miss that?

jibo movie isn't out yet, unfortunately
i was really looking forward to it, but the razer logo over the pentagram on DM6 was disillusioning

mediocre. watch 'Ruination' instead.

It's hardly mediocre :)

imo it is.

if i may quote myself:

there's nothing special, nor unique about this. the frags are boring and sometimes hard to follow. the music is kinda fitting, but i hate it nontheless.
Every goddamn frag in this has been done a gazillion times. even I did 5 usp headshots in a row and sprayed away on ecoround rushes.
it's not impressive on the editing side either. the 'desert eagle" part was kinda cool tho.
i'd give it an 3/10.

and as a reply to: "c'mon, it's not that bad":

tbh you should watch some of the good cs-movies like 'Ruination' or 'complexity:armageddon' to get my point. sure the intro looked good, but that doesn't make up for the rest of the movie.
everything in there has been seen and done before.
now i know that some of it is really impressive, 'cause it's been executed in some final for 50k $ or something, but the movie doesn't get that across.
watch coL: Armageddon for reference.

this is cut way too fast thus hard to follow imo.

i think the desert eagle part was stolen from "snatch" and by stolen i mean just cut the scene out of the movie - not remake it

what's the outro track for ruination? me wantey

E.S. Posthumus - Nara
it's in the credits, stoopid. :E

http://www.own-age.com/vids/2761/mirrors

1 for effort

Good editing, syncing with music is awesome, great movie overall, but still not the best. Ruination n1 even though it's from 2004.

oh man bad idea

content was average, but the editing/syncing to music was top notch.

although the frags were good for cs - the movie was boring as hell most of the time.
not the movie's fault tho, cs just isn't suited well enough for a fragmovie imo

edeting could have been better at times and frags were pretty much the same - so 5/10

restock 4 is one of the best gaming videos ever. It's CS but damn, if it isn't presented in the best way possible. Michael Weicker rules.

nice tracklist

n1 muvie

Not bad of a movie!

I liked it a lot, music sync was very well done =D

pretty impressive

I know the part you're referring to, and this is called recoil control. Something those who say CS is point & click don't seem to understand. When you keep your fire button pressed, your bullets basically go higher (they follow certain patterns). When you get better, you learn to control the recoil, meaning you'll be able to hold down your button and still get your bullets to go where you want them to go. This is usually done by lowering your crosshair (putting it below the enemy, especially with the AK and exactly as in that screenshot) and moving in a certain directions opposite to the spread of the bullets. This is way more complicated than what I just explained, but basically your image shows
1) That he's controlling the recoil
2) That you don't know what you're talking about
3) That trying to make fun of the video for this was stupid from you.
I guess you'll have a witty comeback about CS compared to Q3 though, it's so much easier than being mature.

heh, if you were to give one of those players an AK and then put the game into slowmotion x100 and tell him to spray-fire at a wall making every bullet hit a certain targetted area; he still wouldn't be able to..

i've played cs since beta 3 in 1999/2000 and i'm not too shabby at it, so no need to go through what recoil control is.. it only work to a certain and very limited degree anyway..

my point was, and what i find annoying is that the cs movie scene is all about having some headshot-highlights in a row, and the 'best ones' are the ones where the player barely moves the crosshair killing 5 people with headshots.. but then again, what else would there be to put in the movie if not headshots?

i'm amused that you'd assume that this has anything to do with "cs vs q3", the picture merely demonstrated the ironic definition of "beauty" within counter-strike..

rolf said it best:

1 for effort

Unread iMessage sent @ 19:00 CET 10 Feb 2009

From Belgium Naghokez

Recoil can be controlled very well, saying it works to a very limited degree is pure ignorance.
Holy shit is it obvious day at stupid camp? No shit the point is to show headshots? What else is new? If you're not interested in headshots don't dl the movie in the first place?...
The picture was obviously there to show he got a hs with his crosshair below the guy, and I explained why your post was retarded, especially since in that particular action he followed a typical pattern to control the recoil.

haha

I figured since your post was pretty retarded it wasn't worth polluting the news with more comments of the type. What I said still stands though, what you wrote was idiotic. If you want to continue this discussion use the messages since frankly you obviously have nothing relevant to contribute.

this is no longer a discussion.. at least to me.. this is simply you misunderstanding, being stubborn, and telling me what i mean to say.. have a good day

PS. egd

I answered all your points.

yap yap yap

Yes, its the technique where cs players fight with the game instead of each other. Might as well compete in defrag for the best time :)

Have 2 players stand completely still about 100m from each other. Player 1 fires his USP and gets a headshot. He does not move his mouse at all, waits 2 secs for recoil to be gone, yet his 2nd shot misses completely.


This example is a best-case scenerio with 2 static players. Add the increased randomness of movement, (increasing the random aim of the player firing), add recoil etc and it should be obvious to most, that you cannot control your shots 100% in cs and that luck has a deciding factor when teams are close.


No-one is saying that luck isn't present in other games (spawns can be game-deciding in quake). However, luck is present in cs in every single firefight.

usp first shot always hits 100% accurate - not moving the mouse after it and firing a second after the recoil wears off means you're no longer on the head because the recoil moved your mouse up - desert eagle for example sprays left and right, usp only up - if you set "-mlook" or do centerview after each shot you won't move up/down and you're always on the head - so you'd hit 12 headshots in a row if you just have the patience to wait the ~500ms between the shots

As I said, best-case scenario. No-one waits 500ms between each shot. However, substitute usp with deagle if usp is one of the least random weapons (by cs standards).

No-one waits 500ms between each shot.


Actually, with USP when not at close range... they do.

Why don't you go and play CS competitive and professionally, then you'll understand.

replace 'CS' with anything and that could be replied to all your posts here on ESR

I'm not the one talking out of my ass. I'm not the one who doesn't understand controlling recoil, and that maybe SOME of the shots ARE luck, but it still takes a ridiculous amount of SKILL.

idiot.

Prove it.

http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1657983#pid1657983

That was me making fun of your idiocy.

Duh?

???
how?

http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1657983#pid1657983

that doesn't make sense, idiot.

RAWR >:3

Lucky shots require skill?

Wat?

Controlling recoil takes skill. Sometimes you can also get lucky frags. How hard was it to understand his sentence?

Sigh... No-one is denying that cs takes some skill. However, luck is a (unnecessary) factor.

Your logic is flawed btw. If one has "control" over recoil then there should be no luck involved. But you say so yourself that "Sometimes you can also get lucky frags."

How can that be? How can you get "lucky" when you can "control" the randomness?

-------

What this boils down to is reproducibility. Identical input should give identical output. In q3 your shaft WILL hit where you aim, every time, regardless whether you're moving. In cs your shots will NOT always hit where you're aiming, hence identical input will not produce identical output.

I guess you can test the amount of "control" you have in cs rather easily:

Variation A:
- Do not move your mouse.
- Hold fire and shoot 10 ak47 shots at a wall.
- Wait till recoil is gone
- Shoot another 10 shots.
- Count the bullet holes.
- If there's more than 10 then it's literally impossible to "control" your shots.


Variation B:
- Do not move your mouse.
- Hold fire and shoot 10 ak47 shots at a wall.
- Look at the wall and remember where the 10 shots hit.
- Fire 10 shots while moving your mouse according to the recoil spread you just gathered.
- All 10 shots should now be hitting the same spot.


I eagerly await your demo/video showing how much control there is in cs.


(and we haven't even talked about the loss of control when the shooter is moving)

Note that better cs players have the spray patterns memorized(there's ~10 for ak/colt) so the degree of control is even higher at that level.

do not forget the depth of the situation three dimensionally.. a target further away would mean that the player would have to move the mouse around so much more to hit the same targets..

Nobody said every single shot goes through the same square pixel when pro's are controlling the recoil. The point is that one of the aspects of getting better is controlling the recoil better. This isn't even limited to spraying, but also to bursting & tapping (knowing the exact frequency for each weapon), to knowing how to switch between shooting techniques while avoiding "wasted" bullets etc. One of the reasons why HeatoN is known is that he was among the first players to really control the recoil and use spraying effectively. In France, for example, it was for a long time considered "noobish" to spray (to do a "full auto" in French), because they didn't know how to do it properly. More recently, zet during his time in NiP was very well known for being excellent at controlling the recoil, even and especially while running.

By the way what you didn't answer in PM still stands: if CS was as random as you made it out to be, you'd have dozens of teams at the top, because anyone could end up beating anyone. This isn't the case though, and it's usually the same teams at the top, with one or two above the rest. Which means that the results are hardly completely random.

Sigh... No-one is denying that cs takes some skill. However, luck is a (unnecessary) factor.

Again. No-one claims that cs is completely random. However it's simply a FACT that there's a degree of luck involved, how minor it might be.

You even admit it yourself. I mean omfg... You say that even the pros can't make the shots hit the same place every time.

How can you claim that there is no randomness involved when you've said multiple times that you can get lucky shots?

Your lack of logic is truly astounding :/

You can get lucky shots in Q3 too, it doesn't mean the level of luck is high. Your first posts gives luck in recoil control a lot more importance than it actually has in CS, I would say it is extremely limited in pro matches. It's not about my lack of logic, it's about your lack of knowledge :) I'm not denying that you can't control it 100%, I'm saying your first post shows you don't understand how limited a role this fact plays.

"You can get lucky shots in Q3 too"

No, you cannot. Any weapon (minus mg) in q3 is 100% predictable.

I think you misunderstand what "luck" is in this discussion. Luck are factors outside player control. The randomness generated by CS is outside player control.
Pros limit the effect this randomness will have (using the techniques you mention), but you can never nullify the randomness.

Hence, the last 5-10% of a CS game will be decided by factors outside player control. This is bad.

Replace "shots" by "frags" and think of a telefrag in Q3. And the luck you're referring to in CS hardly accounts for 5-10% of the game, which is what I've been saying all along: you don't know enough about CS :)

Sigh.... Once again. Do you not understand that randomness means outside the control of the player?

Telefrags are not random. They are 100% dependant on player input. When you go through a teleporter you exit the exact same spot every time. And if a player stands there (again, player input) he will die every time.

Respawns on the other hand CAN be game deciding (which I wrote in #40).


The difference between you and I is that I acknowledge the randomness in q3 (mg+spawns). You have blinds on and deny that the randomness in CS can have an influence on a game. Even though it's present nearly every single time you press fire.


PS: Still waiting for those demos/vids from #62 showing how you can eliminate cs randomness. It should be fairly easy to produce.

I did not say the process of telefragging was random. It's user input as you mentioned. I said luck can be involved when you telefrag someone. Don't be so quick to say I don't understand what you're saying when it's you who doesn't get it. This part of my post was originally about not being able to completely get rid of luck, it wasn't specifically about what's inherently random in the game.

About what we were talking about, let me c/p what I wrote since you don't seem to get it: what you're referring to in CS hardly accounts for 5-10% of the game, which is what I've been saying all along: you don't know enough about CS :) The part that the players can't control about the recoil plays such a limited role in kills at a pro level that it has virtually no impact. What is more, CS isn't about getting individual kills but about winning rounds.
Why exactly are you asking for that when I said all the bullets wouldn't go into the same square pixel? If you want to see nice cs recoil control dl any demo from get_right, NEO, f0rest, zet before he played source, w/e.

I'm going to try and write this as simple as possible.

A) Randomness is outside the player's control (in this case, a random number generated by the game).

B) No matter how "pro" you are you cannot eliminate randomness, since it is outside your control.

C) If you can eliminate randomness it is no longer random (see A).

D) You clearly state that bullets will not hit the same place every time (hence, random).

----------

The thing we apparently disagree upon is how much influence this randomness has on games. Let's just leave it at that.

I never disagreed on that. I stated multiple times that it did not have the impact on matches that you said it had.

Yet people don't create movies just for showing off telefrags, do they?

Also, a hint: They're NOT FUCKING RANDOM.

And the kills in the mouz movie are not lucky frags, so I don't see what your point is.
Also, I DID NOT SAY telefrags were random, I said you could get lucky with telefrags. Hint: read.

Yes, you could get lucky because of the game and you could get lucky because of player input. Nice comparison.

Also, why aren't the kills lucky? I don't mean all of them and I have not seen the movie, but the ones that did include recoil are bound to have randomness, aren't they?

Look at the movie? There's no lucky kill thanks to the recoil not being controlled.

holy shit you're stubborn

holy shit you're a fucking idiot.

yea you are. you're opposing yourself everytime, just do yourself a favour and shut up

he won't.. you'll see..

example?

just read your previous posts in this thread, its quite obvious

so obvious you can't give me an example :)

just not really that bothered, ur one of a dozen idiots in here

Still no example :)

Re-read what I said, you obviously still don't understand.

I bet you're the one who goes into a server on CT and wonders why you can't buy an AK.

God, you really are such a bitch.

wtf is this shit

.

A bit too many lame eco rounds with spraying colt vs pistols.

Maybe you should try to ace top teams when they rush eco on you.

cs frags sure are boring. same old all over again, they manage to kill several people standing in thes ame place in a row, OH SHI- ITS A MOVIE FRAGZ

instazero vote fuck yeah

well ... making kills in a row in cs is harder then it seems, anyway it seems to be more luck then skill (HATE ME NOW CS PLAYERS) because its always a matter of lucky headshots while spraying senseless around, in the meaning of aiming at their feet and SPRAY...

some awp shots are nice, the rest is slow bs...

lol a cs movie

i enjoyed the movie, to me whether or not they move the xhair, whether or not it's particularly random, when it's all frags from a lan competition it has greater meaning than just the kills. besides in cs there is a lot you don't see in the movie clips, positioning/waiting/choice of moment are all skillful, as such in professional games i give these players respect and understand the significance. we all have different taste right? infact although it's a q3 movie i think Colosseum by silu is a perfect example of an epic frag movie following competition/teams.

perhaps the movie could have been presented better, i don't feel the soundtracks suited it all that well, something more 'epic' is always a good idea.

a slow waltz would've fitted best

well made but nothing new = 10 because angry cpmnerds have voted so many 0's

as you can't compare cs und q3 movies i'd say this is on eof the best cs movies out there. lets say 8.5/10

I think it simply comes down to this:

Find someone that has never played any game like CS or Q3. Show them an average Q3 movie and the best CS movie. He will be like "holly shit!!" when watching the Q3 movie and probably fall asleep with the CS.

CS is good to play with ur buddies, but is boring to watch.

voted 10 without watching because ahxhahavxaaadgns voted 10

xDDDDDDD

Really enjoyed it, great work and looks very professional!

This entire post is a disappointment. I was under the impression that the Quake community was for more mature than the CS community. Silly me...

what exactly makes you think it's not? this thread?

there are FAR better examples for your point than this thread imo.

Idiot.

didn't like.. way too much cs content

shit, i voted 7... any way to undo that????? *panics*

What a shit boring gay ass game cs is.

I vote 0.

Quake is so much better.

Fuck cs.

Ready Willing & Able

promising title, but totally misleading...

Set phasers to ZERO.