XSplit is great software, even if you don't have great upload speed to broadcast live... you can use it to create local files/presentation with unlimited bandwidth... before i had a sufficient upload speed i used it for creating quick frag clips for youtube (alternative to fraps)!

If you'd like to try the beta just head over to www.xsplit.com and register, i also wrote a quick step by step tutorial that will help you get started: http://levelupyourgame.net/zronvc/files/howtostream.rtf

AFAIK the R.R.P for 2 years is something like $198, so winning it would save you some money!

Anyway CPM rules, get signed up guys!

great news for all 17 cpm players

That was so funny I even thought for a moment you made that all by yourself! Ha!

cpm sucks

:'(

you sucks

Only people with no cpm exp say such things!!! Laaal you must suck horribly at cpm!!

no point to watch if 1/2 bulgarians sign up.

Allready 7 people signed up and atleast one is from Finland, so now you gonna whatch right?

I will definitely tune in since cpm is far more interesting to watch than boring, ups sorry "tactical" vq3 or ql.

can´t wait :))

Sure is, glad you feel the same way.

Well no VQ3 is like chess you see, y'know an ancient turn based strategy game? I believe as black rapha likes to use the sicilian defence (dragon variation)

Just because a game is slower that doesn't make it anything like chess. and FYI the najdorf's winning chances are greater than the dragon, in case you actually play it. Try it out.

winning chances, hehe ok

:P Common chess phrase! <3

liam's very serious about chess, don't rile him up

:P I'm likely more serious. If he's serious, then he probably knows the dragon is more popular among intermediate players and the najdorf among advanced players because they understand the sicilian better. Just trying to help!

nah, rapha's style is totally the opposite of the dragon variation: as black against 1) e4 he'd play either the french or the caro-kann

Technically, the sicilian is the best scoring defense against white's 1.e4 and technically rapha has the best record against his opponents, so I'd imagine it's probably the best-fitting opening for his analogy. It's just a really abstract analogy since chess really isn't anything at all like quake. Who is white, who is black. What constitutes a king's pawn opening for white in quake terms? etc. So you have to be vague about it like i was in "best scoring" terms. Really it's an awful analogy and i wish people wouldn't compare quake to chess at all, since really there's no similarity outside of it's a game.

no no it's like chess

hehe <3

vq3 is like chess

Who is white, who is black.

This deserves a cooller joke but I'm too tired. Someone please do it.

an opening being "technically" better means nothing: just have a look at all those world championship matches, with alekhines,kings indians, even larsen games.

A perfect example to show how your argument is flawed?
Three words: Robert James Fischer.

Also, rapha should hit 100% rg and lg, those being "technically" better: see where this is going?
You're forgetting about personal styles here.

I'm honestly not even sure what you're arguing about. The best scoring opening in quake would be the same as the best scoring opening in chess (again, assuming something in quake constitutes white/black spawn points) because it's the smartest (assuming playing the best scoring opening is a smart move, and if you know how to play it, then it is) response to what you see (see or hear in quake) your opponent doing (assuming 1.e4 in chess). And players are more likely to play the better scoring opening. Of course, in quake, there really aren't but a couple of valid options off the spawn, unlike chess so it's just such a bad analogy right off the bat that, like I said, you have to be super vague in terms of "what's a player like rapha, known for smart play, going to be most likely to play? what's the option that gives him the best chance at equalizing or gaining an advantage? in the case of 1.e4, that's the sicilian, but the sicilian should only be played if you know what you're doing with it." Makes perfect sense. What's the best-scoring defense for black against 1.e4 (again, what constitutes 1.e4 in quake? this analogy was shit from the start)? it's the sicilian, so what's rapha, the best quake live player in the world, MOST likely to play? the sicilian. common sense. (And it's not like you have to study variations off quake spawns of different routes to take lolz). So yes, because the analogy to chess is so terrible, for it to even be semi-valid, it has to be vague in terms similar to those I presented. I.E. best scoring openings.

Rapha is famed on playing the smartest positional game. He plays smart. He would play, right off the bat, whatever opening gave him the best chances AKA the sicilian (what's the best variation? among advanced players, as rapha is in quake, najdorf is extremely common and arguably the best--just ask Kasparov).

FYI championship matches have different types of openings for various reasons. Like the only reason bobby fischer played the english opening in Iceland against spassky was because he knew the russians had been studying responses to 1.e4 really heavily and it would throw him off his game. It doesn't mean bobby fischer thought it was a more sound opening than any king's pawn opening, which he OBVIOUSLY preferred. A lot of players, especially back in the old days (even bobby fischer's time didn't have NEAR the amount of opening theory we do now) mastered a few openings and played them a lot more than others because it's what they're the most familiar and comfortable with, not what they think is best. Doesn't mean one opening isn't better than another. Bobby Fischer would probably have been beaten by Kasparov's sicilian in his prime because kasparov had more opening theory than fischer and he knows openings better than fischer does/did in his prime. I don't know what your point about fischer was. These days, when chess players understand more about the game than any era of players before them, sicilian is much more popular for black against 1.e4 than anything else, and the najdorf especially at the professional level. So I don't know what your point is with other openings being played. We're talking about "most likely to play" here. I never said sicilian is the absolute only legal response to white's opening so there can be no other option, I simply stated that rapha would most likely play the najdorf variation of it because it fits his "style" the most. His style being smart positional play. What do you think he'd play if not the sicilian najdorf?

Like I said, the analogy was shit from the beginning. That's why you have to be so incredibly vague about it. Rapha is known for smarts and positional play, the sicilian is a complicated opening and definitely more geared toward the advanced crowd (and the most common and best-scoring response to 1.e4. some variations are more common in intermediate level--the dragon-- and some more often in the advanced level--najdorf). So what's the most likely to play? in my opinion, it seems to fit rapha's method of operation that he would choose the sicilian.

For the record, what opening do you think rapha would play? I mean, what are you even arguing, dude? It seems that you're arguing that rapha would not play the sicilian, or the najdorf variation, or what? What "style" do you think fits him best? Sicilian najdorf is spot on for rapha, as in it's the best response (according to statistic, anyway) to king's pawn openings and is rapha is known for what I would assume people consider playing "best-scoring" moves in-game and not being all flashy with aim or aggression. But, like I've said countless times by now, the analogy is so shitty and invalid that neither of us can make a real point here. Which is why i said in the first place that the analogy was shit. And back to square one. :P

I didn't expect you to write so much about this: if you don't mind, for the sake of my own mental sanity, i'll have to pick different quotes and reply to each of them.


First of all when you say:
"Like I said, the analogy was shit from the beginning. That's why you have to be so incredibly vague about it. "
I couldn't agree more with you: they're totally different games which simply share the enemy's prediction+talent+mindgame (the latter being pointless in chess) aspects.
I'd dare to say quake offers a more " humanly complex" challenge, as there are not as many real inferior choices which would be brutally punished in chess but are often overlooked in quake (traps).

Then again, I can't understand this whole wall of text pretending to prove ME wrong on the whole analogy, when you attempted to do the same, with the najdorf-rapha thing.


"Being "technically" better DOES mean something. It means that, if all else played correctly, this is your best bet for winning the match, and rapha is most likely to play the "best bet" for winning --in this case being the sicilian (more specifically, at his level, the najdorf). So I have no idea what exactly you're trying to refute."

I'll try to explain why this, to me of course, is the most retarded chess related thing I've ever heard.
I wonder if you even have an ELO rating.

First of all, since you're assuming "if all else played correctly" (which is idiotic per se), the najdorf would still lose to white.Full stop. This is what your logic suggests.

A player like rapha wouldn't gamble to always play such a theory-heavy (I'm currently holding a 461 pages book on a subvariation of a subvariation of it, poisoned pawn in case you know it, and it's already outdated), tacticism-complex opening just for the sake of it.

Rapha ain't no Fischer, rapha ain't no Morphy, rapha ain't no Reshevsky(I hope you, being american, will be pleased by my examples).
The best chess analogy for rapha would be Karpov (not Kasparov as you suggested), or Botvinnik, or Petrosjan (although Cooller comes to mind when talking about this last one).
He wasn't gifted with as much talent ( READ:hand to eye coordination for quake, raw calculus skills in chess) as other players, he's there at the top because of his superior mindgame (which is something that wouldn't work in chess at all) and determination.
He's not the Reshevsky who could calculate up to 20-25 moves in wildly intricated positions, he's not the Toxjq who has a ridicolous accuracies. (The Reshevsky-Tox analogy is very accurate, hope you'll notice it)

Rapha/ Karpov wouldn't dare to play the najdorf (read: heavy aggression, aim-based) against a strong aimer(stermy,tox,strenx)/Fischer , because he'd knew that, because of his flawless style and (most of the times) superior choices would grant him more winning chances on different, more solid systems like the french, which could generate positions where, even if he doesn't know the whole theory he could still win those, choosing better in-game options.
He'd rely on his aforementioned skills, rather than pure memorization of a theoretical line (in which there's always a chance to get a new , better, stronget, not analized move, in Quake the analogy would be better aim), in which other players might prevail

Plus, it's not like the french is an inferior opening, you've got to be fucking kidding me. Play the game and stop reading statistics or listening to your Fritz 11 computer program.

In the same way, a 100 hp 10 armor rapha wouldn't go lg vs lg against a known strong 100 hp 0 armor aimer, just because he has BETTER STATISTICS OF WINNING IT.
Have you actually seen his games?
He gets the kill when he's almost sure about it, he never gambles.

"Also, in quake, your opening options are EXTREMELY limited compared to chess. Really totally dissimilar. "

Couldn't agree more but I never stated the opposite, so why are you telling me these old news?


"Rapha is famed on playing the smartest positional game. He plays smart. He would play, right off the bat, whatever opening gave him the best chances AKA the sicilianagain"

The najdorf being positional?
Let's get real now, is your elo even close to the 2,2k mark?
I can't be arsed to answer to such an atrocity.

"I don't know what your point about fischer was."

It was that he's been the most dominant player ever, on the top with Morphy and Kasparov (althought the latter one had a whole bunch of soviets helping him out,assisting, spoon feeding him new theory and ideas, whereas Fischer did it all by himself), whilst playing , always, the same inferior openings, as you put them: go check the statistics for the king's indian, and compared them to the queen's gambit declined.
Yet he steamrolled the competition, and was on a whole different level.
I could go on for hours regarding Fischer, think I own every single book regarding him or his games.

"these days, when chess players understand more about the game than any era of players before them"

I beg to differ.
This is so obvious (it works like that for every other field/game/etc in the world), yet , in this very case, it's wrong to put it like that.
They don't UNDERSTAND it, they MEMORIZE it.

If you were right, we'd see no mistakes at all in those high-end competitions (latest wijk aan zee comes to mind), only a few relatively weak moves, but no blunders whatsoever.
The game of chess evolves because of computers, which pile up so much theory and calculations that obliterate what was done in the previous centuries (and on a sidenote they still prove Fischer's opening theories valid, especially on the Bc4 sicilian)


"I simply stated that rapha would most likely play the najdorf variation of it because it fits his "style" the most. His style being smart positional play. What do you think he'd play if not the sicilian najdorf?"

The french against e4, which, in quake speak, is an aggressive enemy, like the old strenx.
He'd never open with e4, he'd go for either d4 , c4 or nf3.

"A lot of players, especially back in the old days (even bobby fischer's time didn't have NEAR the amount of opening theory we do now) mastered a few openings and played them a lot more than others because it's what they're the most familiar and comfortable with, not what they think is best. "

Fischer was such on another level he managed to asnwer with the correct moves, right in front of the board, against theoretical novelties (fischer-petrosjan candidates match 1971 b44 sicilian against 7)...d5!)

Plus, Fischer didn't have a pool of soviets backing him up on the analysis during those days, nor had the computer programs chess pros have nowadays.

Again, I beg to differ, quoting Fischer's own words: " 1) e4: the best, by principle"


" Sicilian najdorf is spot on for rapha, as in it's the best response (according to statistic, anyway) to king's pawn openings and is rapha is known for what I would assume people consider playing "best-scoring" moves in-game and not being all flashy with aim or aggression"

Your logic is right, yet your facts aren't.
The najdorf is the flashy,aggressive, all aim chess option, where everything that matters is memorizing dozens of book, and having raw calculus talents, in which rapha wouldn't able to win against opponents who are better than him at that (aim wise).
He wouldn't take those risks, and would adapt his opening style accordingly (again, please refer to the old rapha-strenx games, especially those on dm6).

slowclap.gif

I'm still trying to grasp what you're arguing with that comment. Maybe you're saying that rapha could potentially win with any opening like king's indian defense/attack or some tricky gambit? Being "technically" better DOES mean something. It means that, if all else played correctly, this is your best bet for winning the match, and rapha is most likely to play the "best bet" for winning --in this case being the sicilian (more specifically, at his level, the najdorf). So I have no idea what exactly you're trying to refute. Technically better DOES mean something in terms of what we've been talking about. Technically better means that, at the highest level (of which rapha is at in quake ofc), it's proven itself statistically to be the best opening for a certain side.

Your comment on 100% rg and lg further emphasizes my point about how completely retarded the analogy to chess is. Because, now days, chess is at such a precise level (thanks to engines) that chess professionals would be hitting, in quake terms, closer to the high 90s in percent for all weapons. Besides, aiming % means nothing because chess is 100% thought, there is no skill or aim in picking up a piece of wood and placing it on a board that will affect winning chances in chess. :P

Also, in quake, your opening options are EXTREMELY limited compared to chess. Really totally dissimilar.

vo0, gelleh, aph, and vamp have been playing recently

;o

aph playing again? for real?

hes played a few duels/pickups for fun somewhat recently.
he's moved to terrible ping, though ;(

^____________________________^

what's with the retarded final games?

2xbo3 or a real bo5 pls

One of the classic systems.

must be an ancient greek system cause the first time I saw it was at the last tourney

It really has been around forever. I guess u guys don't play alot of tournaments ;)

touche :)

still a bad system tho :(

Can't wait, won't be participating myself because I know I wouldn't make it past the first round but I'm hoping to see some sick games

Would play, but I'm on holiday.. :D

err, I mean ):

2ez

those final rules are weird..

!promote

well this will be interesting to cast ;-)

no i go cast

Yay cpm

lmao@cpm

lmao@izi, xoxo

GO FAZZ

<3

who's commentating?

can u remove the cumstain from top right

I was referring to the promode logo and whatever black shit is around it, not the multiview /facepalm

oh no i forgot i wanted to play this :'(

if you have reddit, do upvote: http://www.reddit.com/r/esports/comments/joy8...featuring/

thanks! :)

Got this mousebug aswell in CPM. Sometimes I just can't shoot. Annoying!

If you are refering to what I said, its not what i meant. It is that my mouse freaksout and looks up/down when i move it fast, and that never happens in ql for me.

Ye I was refering to you, so we got 2 different mousebugs.

I guess you're not using a client that supports raw input ?

cnq3.exe

I meant a quake3 client, not a pos that would randomly decide it would generate its own cfg instead of using my autoexec.

?

Used to have a ton of random cfg/mouse problems with it around 2 years ago, switched to a hacked q3.exe ( only change is the addition of raw input ) that should be lying somewhere around.

use dfengine.

You have a broken mouse cable and aren't moving it fast enough in QL to cause the problem.

So this Captivate guy is Vo0?

It's funny: fakenicking when there are like 10 people that plays cpm. What are the chance they won't recognaze you?

CPM right now is nothing more than a bunch of stuck-up kids with an attitude rocket jumping all over dm6.

not really

lol why post?

VODs? I missed it! >.<

it's still on.

damnit! ESR had it as "passed" already. poop. Well, it's apparently actually over now, so any vods? :)

Not a single comment about GTV? Wow I guess nobody misses it anymore...

pls turn off multiview

So who is this this Captivate guy?

rat ofc.

Captivate.

derp

vo0

I say Vorpal.

vorpal would have less than 100 ping, he's east coast.

who was that flipping out about a "retarded community"?

190 viewers average, dropped a little after nzro vs hal9000 :D

thanks for playing guys

thank you, nevergreen and ethad for the cup

Whats up with VODs? There is a VOD 2 hour 25 minutes long, but game it ends is ddk vs nzr0. Where's the rest?

http://cs.twitch.tv/leveluptv/b/293080449

also there are links under the video for part 2 of the video

Thanks =]

who won?

1. Nzr0
2. Captivate
3. wuxia

iirc

Nice cup. Congrats Nzr0.

Demos????????????

demos pls & vods pls

HOW COME THERE ARE NO VODS AND DEMOS AND CONFIGS YET?

MAKES ME ANGRY

Really enjoyed watching it, especially the aero game between nzro and hal.

What I don't like about CPM is that you can't pick up a YA when you have 133 or more RA.
Players shouldn't have to damage themselves to pick up an armor.

Why not? It adds to the strategy making endless loop the loop a little riskier.

some VODs are here --> http://cs.twitch.tv/leveluptv

Demos will be uploaded today/tommorow on challenge-tv

enjoy

the ammo system is so awesome compared to ql, ql is so fuckign spmmajkhaekjyaYM YMAY AFSd

What's the difference?

ammo? joke? or u mean armour?

nope i mean ammo, ofc the armor system is great aswell. but i hate how spammy ql duel is, the biggest factor why i hardly play it

In duel picking up a new RL when you already have 10 rockets + RL gives you nothing, if you have 7 ammo it only bumps it to 10. In TDM it always gives you another 10 afaik and that happens in ql duel as well.

How should the ammo system work?

guess you read me wrong, its fine as is

not like you can change it now anyways :P

If there was something people wanted changed we could release a new version. That's not a threat that we're about to impose random changes on people though. =)

Great tourney. Looking forward to more in the future, so much more enjoyable than quakelive tournaments, even with 140 ping.

CHEERS!

Next cup soon... Next month probably.

So where are the VODs of vo0 and nzr0 etc.?

All I see is Hal 9000 nzr0 and ddk

http://cs.twitch.tv/leveluptv/b/293080449

There really needs to be a tournament with a prizepool worth playing for, as these games had no class. I guess when there's no motivation to actually hit those railshots or do something besides jumping around trying to look cool, we get games like these. Really, I know that the players in question are capable of so much more, yet these games were...

On a more positive note, the rant on warping and lag was entertaining.

-taran

Honestly I thought a lot of the games were really lame, i.e. they were playing CPM like Quake Live. Few people besides Hal 9000 were actually bunnyjumping around Quake World style and doing fast aggressive moves like CPM was supposed to be. Instead a lot of the games looked like a QL duel.

An xsplit key r.r.p is $198, and a roccat sota r.r.p is $20.

obviously many players prefer prize money (myself included) but i can't magically pull money out of my arse. If you compare the value of this prize against a single online QL tournament i.e. Zotac and JeeSports, I actually don't think there's much room for dissapointment, the prizes offered are a relatively good "alternative" to them anyway considering the livestream spectators averaged at 200 throughout.

There's an element of truth to what you're saying though for sure, but it's not like we'll see the next $1000 CPM tournament of which players will practice several hours per night anytime soon. Just take it for what it is, a fun one day cup that i wanted to help promote as i enjoy CPM the most out of any game. I'm atleast satisfied with the turnout, compared to both signups and spectators in cpmduel #5 it was a vast improvement, i just hope xsplit will provide prizes for #7, or maybe a 2v2 tournament!

Damn US keyboard layout...