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Forums > Hardware Forum

MS Basic Optical? What do you think? (26 comments)

( Forum: HW)

Posted by Lorfa @ 20:45 CDT, 7 September 2011 - iMsg

Microsoft Basic Optical Mouse 2.0

http://www.microsoft.com/hardware/en-us/p/basic-optical-mouse

"Tiz3r" on the QL forums mentioned he had this mouse and liked it. I had never heard of it before.

Basic Information:

800 cpi Optical

3000 fps (vs. 9000 on the wmo)

LOD comparable to the wmo

20 inches/sec malfunction speed (MS states the same for the wmo, hard to know how truthful it is).

92.8 grams with cord. To give you an idea MS lists the wmo as weighing 125 grams with cord, without cord it weights about 77 grams, a 48 gram cord. If this mouse has a 48g cord it would weigh 44.8 grams.

It appears to have a better scroll wheel than the wmo.

A spiral in paint here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4022585/msbom20spiral.png

Photos of its innards here:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4022585/msbom20pics.zip

Sensor info:

Per the photos, it appears to be a PAW3502DLZ-M2 .

The closest data sheet on that I could find is here:

http://pdf1.alldatasheet.com/datasheet-pdf/vi...asheet.pdf

Which refers to a PAW3502DL 800 CPI. I couldn't find any reference to a DLZ-M2 anywhere.

MS data sheet here:

http://download.microsoft.com/download/2/D/3/...SBV2.0.pdf

Photos and drawings by Tiz3r.

10925 Hits

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<< Comment #1 @ 21:00 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Skylit

I may try this. Do you know if you can bump the polling rate?

I mean MS also rates their new comfort bluetrack line "up to 72ips", but I believe the sensor is bottlenecked due to the 125hz limitation. 40 IPS malfunction ftl :[

<< Comment #6 @ 21:15 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #1

You can increase the polling rate yes.

Will ask tiz3r to run some more tests in that regard.

Oh btw he weighed it without the cord and got about 50 grams.

<< Comment #2 @ 21:05 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

I deploy those in keyboard/mouse combo kits for work all the time with new workstations. I can make those skip no problem with little effort.

<< Comment #4 @ 21:13 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #2

Are you sure these are the same ones?

This is a P58-00022 2.0 version. There's some other versions out there that have a malfunction speed akin to 1st gen opticals. This guy tiz3r actually likes the mouse for QL, I doubt he would be able to tolerate it if it was this bad.

Can you check the part numbers on those that you have?

<< Comment #9 @ 22:22 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

spinmove_ - Reply to #4

I'll have to see. I'd like to see a decent budget optical come out of microsoft again. Hell, I'd like to see everyone make decent budget opticals. There's no reason why every manufacturer out there can't make mice that don't skip.

<< Comment #3 @ 21:12 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

jstn

20 ips

Nope.

<< Comment #5 @ 21:14 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #3

Uh, the WMO is also listed as 20 ips.

It's not a "nope".

<< Comment #7 @ 21:36 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

I have a couple of these. I am in the process of putting a WMO PCB inside one to create a "mini WMO". If there is a new generation of them that doesn't skip just from breathing near it I'd be very keen on trying it out!

<< Comment #8 @ 22:14 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #7

Can you verify the model numbers? I suspect there are different versions floating around and they might use different sensors.

<< Comment #10 @ 22:27 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

maltyplaya - Reply to #8

I have the opened shell of one here, it doesn't have the sticker on it but it says "MS-7043 REV" embossed on the plastic (interior) as well as 15112123201. It also says R31264 on the base. I'm assuming the revision number is the one you are after. I will check the sticker on the unopened one soon.

<< Comment #11 @ 22:52 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #10

What's the part number?

Examples:

P/N X802382

P58-00022

Should be on the bottom of the mouse under the bar code.

<< Comment #12 @ 23:06 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

maltyplaya - Reply to #11

The unopened one has a part number of X817159-002. They both have dismal tracking and were purchased close together so I assume they are similar.

<< Comment #13 @ 23:45 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #12

Ok thanks for that info.

The x indicates an OEM version, I'm not sure if it is an OEM of the P58-00022.. yet.

Will keep looking.

<< Comment #16 @ 06:14 CDT, 8 September 2011 >>

By

maltyplaya - Reply to #13

Cool. Let us know if there is a revision with similar tracking to the WMO. It will save me some soldering, although I will probably eventually still try it with the WMO PCB just for fun.

<< Comment #18 @ 20:22 CDT, 9 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #16

Well now I'm not sure what's up.

Here's the P/N screenshot:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/4022585/IMAG0124.jpg

P/N # X820471-002

I was sure that the order site at least appeared to be non-OEM, so maybe the X doesn't necessarily mean that. There's no 58 number in the screenshot that I can see. Maybe it's actually the OEM version they are selling and the non-OEM has at p/n of p58-00022? No idea.

He says the polling rate runs stable at 500 hz, and he says it doesn't skip.

Malty if you happen to be doing some modding take a high res screenshot of the sensor ic so we can get its model number.

Edited by Lorfa at 20:23 CDT, 9 September 2011

<< Comment #14 @ 23:53 CDT, 7 September 2011 >>

By

w0nk0

i think i used one when i went home to india on vacation. it feels super super small. it also had weird sides and combine that with the fact that its quite tall for such a small mouse and you get really shitty grip. but this is more or less personal. response felt a little strange at 125hz but didnt test it out at 500.

<< Comment #17 @ 06:40 CDT, 8 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #14

This is something I was definitely concerned about.

The wmo has a nice smooth backside (lol), this one has a point that sticks out kinda like this: >

It's also skinnier than the wmo according to the dimensions.

I suppose wider, flatter mice are more comfortable. Pancake mouse anyone?

<< Comment #15 @ 02:50 CDT, 8 September 2011 >>

By

crea* '

It's not suited for gaming.

<< Comment #19 @ 20:45 CDT, 9 September 2011 >>

By

�bst

Bad sensor, its ok for high sens, but you can't move it fast when you have low sens (even at 1000hz, which it can't do btw, its limited to about 670hz), also has a very high lift off distance, and has quite strong prediction.

<< Comment #20 @ 22:29 CDT, 9 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #19

What sensor? What model number?

<< Comment #22 @ 23:31 CDT, 9 September 2011 >>

By

�bst - Reply to #20

I don't think it really matters as long as it has "3502" in it and its made by pixart, at its core its not good for gaming.

It has a range of options, which is what the letters after 3502 are for, but you'll be really damn lucky if any of those options give you a decent gaming mouse.

I mean for a start it performs best at 400dpi, and the ms basic optical is 800, so its already not making the most out of the sensor. I'd just give up if I were you :)

<< Comment #23 @ 03:29 CDT, 10 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #22

Well you might be right but you gave such specific information on the sensor that I was curious as to how you obtained it.

There's no mention of prediction in the datasheet, but not sure if they typically mention that kind of thing.

<< Comment #21 @ 22:32 CDT, 9 September 2011 >>

By

seems like this guy is trolling you making you go on such a long witchhunt

<< Comment #24 @ 03:36 CDT, 10 September 2011 >>

By

Lorfa ' - Reply to #21

Well, I don't think he's trolling but it is not impossible.

It's not really such a witch hunt since I've gone through this kind of thing before many times.

The real witch hunt is for a mouse that is actually an improvement on the wmo.

It seems like every new mouse that comes out has some critical flaw that renders it instantly inferior to the wmo. All the while the wmo itself is not a perfect mouse.

An improved cord, scroll wheel, malfunction speed, 1000 hz, teflon feet, lower the weight as much as possible, perhaps decrease the lift off distance and maybe allow for some different cpi values. There's a real market for such a mouse to this day (how long has it been since the wmo was released?) no such luck.

<< Comment #25 @ 18:52 CDT, 10 September 2011 >>

By

Raist

dont ever ever ever bvelng everk jş ever EVER EVER EVER EVVMNIKAFAFKN BUY BASIC EVER

it skips when you swing the mouse beyond a certain speed, worst fucking mouse ever and just a ripped off wmo that doesnt work

<< Comment #26 @ 17:42 CDT, 20 May 2013 >>

By

naper

Used it for years, the worst mouse ever.

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