Played 7 hours, dropped. It's all the same.

could i have your copy then? :p

thepiratebay.org?

:<

Game is so good. Playing a thief style char as well, sneaking in this game works brilliantly. No sign of Oblivions scaling problems yet either with no random bandits running around in full Daedric, at least not at level ~30.

the witcher 2 was bettar

Yeah I think so, but it's not released on consoles. :P

they are making console port!

The witcher 2 combat was better but there is so much more to do in skyrim compared to the witcher 2. Sadly the combat in skyrim is a kiting game most of the time.

by "more to do" u mean running around the world without a point?

More lore, more dungeons, more loot, more everything else and properly more mods in a few month which with enchant the game to a even better deal.

yeah... and close to no storyline... thats the biggest problem with TES - they always have boring mainquests, that last for 4 hours... doubt they will make a mod that will fix it

And there were no mainquests in The witcher 2?
Story's and games have always been boring and very narrow line I am not drive by a games story in this case. In Skyrim I play the game as I go along the game dont force you to go left which the witcher 2 did, that say the witcher 2 wasnt bad but it wasnt good either at some points it was lack the open world stuff which Skyrim have.

hes saying that the witcher 2 mainquest and overral writing is so much better than any TES game

how can you say ' no story line '? the story is deep as fuck. have you been playing it or are you just hating?

i dont play TES games, they are always the same... good storyline would ruin their game model, and even creators admitted it multiple times

well, it does make sense, however, the story is pretty good. That's just my opinion though. i didn't mean any offense btw... to each his own.

it takes more to offend me :-)

Awesome game. Only thing I didn't figured out is how to quickly find a trader without having to speak with everyone when Im new to the city. Any idea ?

Btw playing with nord, focusing on magic xD

glad you like it, but then again you like tf2 so I got to ask:
- is the world leveling up with you?
-is there a compass?
- how about mouse controls? is it possible to aim properly as in archery etc? can sens be set precisely?
-can fov be set?
-how's the UI?

There is a compass.
There is a config file that can change everything you mentioned.
UI isn't very good, mods will work on that over time I'm sure.

The world does level up with you but not as blatantly as say Oblivion. Enemies get scaled from a base type of enemy, say a bandit, to higher ranks of that type. A low level bandit is just a "bandit", then as you level you'll start seeing higher level bandits such as "bandit highwayman" and other more powerful types. There does seem to be a limit on how high enemies can scale to in a given area though, and also limits to how low they can scale in certain areas.

Some parts level with you, but not all. Mostly just shops. There's a small issue with the mouse Y axis (X is fine) being tied to framerate, which can be an issue if you are pushing your video card. Dunno if you can turn off the compass, since it doubles as a "shout" meter - I'd like to see that changed for those who prefer to play without. FOV can be set with config. The UI needs a ton of work, as it was designed for consoles.

so leveling is something like new vegas? I really liked nv, come to think of it, Im not sure there was any leveling at all there, except bandit guns maybe.

anyway, would you suggest I wait for patches/mods?


also compass
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/615805-the-eld...m/61035520

Very much like New Vegas. It's more than playable already, so no need to wait for mods. A patch is coming out soon, and hopefully it will fix some of the interface issues that PC users are dealing with.

It's better than Oblivion, i'll give it that. Upgraded from "good grief this game is godawful, my brain is dead" to "good grief this game is boring, my brain hurts".

Point by point:

The UI is all over the place. What a fucking mess, i thought Oblivion's could not be topped in terms of awfulness, but here we are! Well done.

Level scaling. By now it's a staple of Bethesda games, so you kinda go into it knowing the game will rob you of the satisfaction that comes from character progression. Improvement on Oblivion but it's still a god-damn atrocity and the lazy way out of balancing your game.

Fighting and magic systems are better than in Oblivion, thankfully. The AI is still pretty dumb most of the time (huge upgrade from Oblivion's "broken beyond repair"), though, and the controls feel a bit sloppy.

Graphics are decent, animations and models range from meh to what the fuck is this shit.

The plot. Hey look, you get to save the world. Again. What a surprise.

The quests are your typical Bethesdian fedex bs. Didn't expect anything else, still disappointing they didn't put more effort in them.

Compass and quest markers. I hate handhelding, but at least you can turn that shit off.

Writing is just bad. Almost as bad as in Fallout 3, and nowhere near as bad as in Oblivion. But still bad. Most dialogues are retarded, the characters are bland and feel like info posts/item dispensers. I'd say it's a step up.

Too bad about the even more castrated character development options, but since progression is mostly irrelevant and superficial, i don't think it's worth bitching about it.

Dungeons are not too bad. Usual linear crap with some puzzles and big bad boss fights here and there, but at least they're made out of different texture sets and don't feel like they're copypasted. Exploration is much more fun as well. Though, is it just me, or are the bandits fucking everywhere? Jesus christ. You'd think by how many of them there are, by now the whole island would be a giant slaver camp.

All in all, it is vastly superior to both Fallout 3 and Oblivion, but all that means is that it's just a pretty mediocre game. I'll admit it's not as terrible as i thought it would be, but it still doesn't excuse the glaring flaws it has. It does mean that Bethesda is learning from it's past abortions, which is nice. Maybe the next game will approach something at least slightly similar to Morrowind's quality.

ps. Saying "it can be modded and made better" does not excuse the flaws it has out of the box, sorry.

I have only really played Fallout New Vegas before this, which I thought was excellent. But I guess it's not really a Bethesda game (?)

Comparing that to Skyrim:

I like the setting of New Vegas a lot more, but thats down to personal taste.

I haven't followed the main plot of Skyrim much, yet. So I don't really know what to make of it. But I can't say it has immediately grabbed me like New Vegas. Where the main plot is always in the back of your mind, even while you are doing other stuff.

Instead I have mostly been doing missions for the wizards college, trying to become good with magic. This is fucking hard.

First of all the destruction magic you begin with is very weak compared to regular weapons. So instead I have been using a lot of one handed swords and stuff. Now magic is slowly getting better, but due to the way the game works it has given me a very high one handed fighting rating, and switching over to magic feels like a waste :/

Secondly, when your this wizardly type your supposed to wear these robes and shit which give magic buffs. The only problem is they have zero armor. Meaning you take massive damage all the time. Instead your supposed to cast something like stoneskin before you get into a fight, temporarily boosting your armor rating. This is very tedious, especially since the UI is so fucking frustrating and clearly designed for a joypad. Why can't I just bind a spell to a specific key and press that to cast it? FFS. I really love dying over and over and over and over... sigh

Also the missions I have done so far are pretty bland. Fetch this item, talk to that person, talk to this person, go trough generic dungeon X etc. It literally took me something like 3 hours going trough a single generic bland dungeon on my last mission, and now they are sending me to some place called labyrinthian ... wow the joy.

But despite all the above, it's still quite fun just wandering about the (very pretty) world and exploring stuff. Other than that though it has been rather meh until now.

Not to get too elaborate on the point, i personally thought New Vegas was a pretty damn good game as well. It had strong writing, a nice plot, really well developed characters, non-linear quest progression, also a nifty little upgrade/crafting system, skill and attribute checks (yeah F3 had those as well, but they were few and far between and had little impact on the game), some nice exploration and locations... i honestly enjoyed the hell out of it.

And yeah it was developed by Obsidian, which actually has some guys that worked on the original Fallout games on their payroll. They get the game and the setting, and it showed. You might try playing Fallout 3 for comparison and see how huge an impact the writing has. I guarantee your brain will melt from the bs dialogues and exposition before you even get out of the vault.

Yeah I played a little bit of fallout 3, but never really got into it.

same. got bored after 3 days and I even bought a new machine just to play it.. thankfully nv was fucking awesome.

I haven't followed the main plot of Skyrim much, yet. So I don't really know what to make of it.

I haven't gotten too far, but it just seems like it really only lends itself well to a warrior-type character.

Instead your supposed to cast something like stoneskin before you get into a fight, temporarily boosting your armor rating.

I never do. Stoneskin is more for conjuration mages who use conjured weapons, not for destruction mages. Just don't let them get near you. Get the perk that lets your dual cast spells stagger the opponents, and you'll be able to kill most enemies without any trouble. Also, rune spells are amazing for groups of enemies.

Stick with fire spells early on, and then probably shock spells later. Frost doesn't seem to be useful for anything other than fire enemies.

It doesn't lend to just warrior types man. You can do some great stuff with Mage or Theif also. I will be playing a mage next for sure... (i'm a nord warrior, but only use one handed and i always am dual casting fire or spark) It's really all about how you level yourself up... you can choose a class, but you are not bound to that class at all throughout the game.

ps. ICE SPIKE kicks ass. Frost spells do alot of stamina damage and are great for fire breathing dragons.

As a thief/assassin type, I almost never use shouts. With light or clothing armor, dragons are mostly just a pain, because you can't take advantage of sneak bonus.

For a mage, I found lightning bolt + dual cast stagger perk was overpowered as hell. Long range, hitscan, huge damage, and the stagger lasts longer than charging up another dual cast. You can pretty much stunlock anything in the game, and even at about level 25, you will never run out of mana by casting it.

good point on the shouts and light armor. I suppose if I were going to be a theif/assassin dragons would be much harder.

The quests are your typical Bethesdian fedex bs. Didn't expect anything else, still disappointing they didn't put more effort in them.

You must not have been playing long, as they get MUCH better.

I was broadly generalizing, of course. Even Oblivion had some good quests (Dark Brotherhood quest line, for instance). Unless you mean there's a glaring cut-off point after which every quest in the game suddenly elevates to Torment's level of quality?

there are tons of quality quests which are linked to each other and the LORE of tamriel, you can expect to read a random book ingame and get a hidden quest somewhere about that issue.
a certain intellectual( or what you would call realistic) level is not what i consider the bulk about quality quests

Wow, LORE of Tamriel? Must have missed all that in every Elder Scrolls game since Arena. Getting a quest from a source that isn't an NPC? Such innovation! Not like basically every crpg in existence had that before. Branching quest paths? Oh wait, you said "quests linked with each other", must be yet another revolutionary Skyrim concept which i failed to comprehend.

Thank you, friend. My understanding of Skyrim, and our collective reality in general, has been improved via the medium of your sage wisdom.

none of us talked about innovation, sir. you even compare it to other games, so couldn't direct to innovation either.

I'm of course talking about comsumability and presentation of the story,lore,fiction.

since your pro-con rant just had this 2 little sentences about this major part of the experience (quest, plot), i just wanted to bitchslap you left and right, sir.

You contextually depicted it like it was innovation, so pardon my presumptions on the matter. I already conceded that i was, and i quote, "broadly generalizing", so i have not much more to add to this, unless we'd venture into in-depth analysis and play-by-play commentary on specific parts of the quests presented in the game and the overarching main plot, which i, personally am not willing to do as it would be:

1) an extremely pointless waste of my time, and

2) beyond the parameters of what my original post was trying to accomplish, which was to give a "broad and general" opinion of what i feel about the game.

Having established all that, i'm still curious what you were trying to convey with your previous post. I already stressed how important overall quality of writing is to me, and that includes the way the quests and the plot is presented to the players, and i already wrote that i feel they're both generic. Neither good nor bad, just generic, high fantasy mumbo-jumbo one would expect from a game like this, by a company like this.

You stated good writing is not what you expect or need to derive enjoyment from playing out the main and side storylines, and i have no problem with that. What i do have problem with, is that you also stated that the aforementioned writing is "quality" (i, again, presume that is a superlative comment), a statement which i vehemently oppose.

"Quality" is having the option of making the end boss of the game kill himself over the flaws of his ultimate plan, if your character has certain attributes high enough, and you had the foresight to explore the possibility beforehand.

"Quality" is having elaborate backstories for otherwise generic NPC's (at which point they stop being generic).

"Quality" is having to make morally challenging choices, and said choices affecting your future interaction with other NPC's populating the world, as opposed to easy to implement and write, bland "black and white", "good and evil" paths which do not affect anything outside the immediate storyline.

"Quality" is having fun with your creation and squeezing the setting out of every ounce of juice it has, as opposed to taking the safe path out by catering to every modern game cliche in existence, just so nobody will freak out.

I observed none of such quality in Skyrim. Perchance sir would care to enlighten a poor, lost soul such as myself in the Ways of the Todd and his Skyrim fanboy caste?

well, first of all i want to apologize that my post won't be as thoughtful or civilized as yours, since i'm having a lot of stuff going on in my head which is not filled with deeper thoughts about the contemporary gamingscene and it's flaws. but i'll try my best and make up some standpoints on the fly as usual. :O

second point is i don't think this game is perfect or near perfect in terms of a gaming experience, that contains both personal preference and realistic evaluation of the current possibilities.

yes, i missed the statement that you were "broadly generalizing", but with such a highly acclaimed and historydriven game, it's suitable to leave this away. it would also have set me back to post my original attack against your post, since it looked like you'd have no rpg experience at all.

to your quality examples:

#1 happens in skyrim, just not every time

#2 indeed important and lacking, but i somehow feel that this is due to the total voiceacting implemented, means that it would be extremely expensive to put even more into the game (btw i'm not talking about books triggering quests, i mean you find books containing a topic and it could appear ingame as quest, as a topic in conversation, etc.)

#3 that happens (yep, nothing new) somewhat but is lacking if you really looking for it.

#4 agree

but just 4 parts out of hundreds, noone said it's perfect, even you say it's a "progress" in many ways but maybe just irregular?


what i connect with quality in lore,plot and quests in a game like the elder scrolls is the warm feel of just standing in a village and beeing part of it somehow, which is aswell connected with the sound, the grapihcs and the resulting atmosphere, like a tasty soup.

well, you get a quest somewhere and get drowned by ideas of design, artwork, humor, hugeness, awareness, etc.. =my quality, good writing would just be another ingredient to me.

skyrim is basicly what i would expect of a highpowered, highly acclaimed and highly mainstreamed new pc-game, something i would recommend my little brother,etc.

i do understand your point, but there is no academic approach, and it doesn't state it somewhere.

It's ok man, we're just exchanging thoughts and opinions, no need to apologize for anything.

Alright, so onto your points. Let me get one thing clear right off the bat - i have years upon years of rpg experience behind my back, both computer and tabletop. However, i don't even perceive the TES games like classic rpg's, in the sense that you don't really get so much choice in what character you are portraying (unless you're larping, but that's emergent metagaming, not a mechanic).

To be perfectly honest, i see them like more of a subtle mix of exploration games akin to Elite III and Star Control II with a different perspective, setting and some rpg elements thrown in.

The reason i'm saying all that is to show why i'm holding back on direct comparison to titles more fitting the rpg template, like Fallout or Arcanum. It wouldn't be fair for either game. I think they're (the Bethesdesque sandbox exploration games) in a genre of their own.

As such, i can understand why some people put more emphasis on different aspects of the experience than i would. Where i see poorly written dialogue leading up to a disappointing resolution of a quest, someone else might see a chance to explore a whole new location. Where i see fast-tracked exposition, someone else might see a shortcut to the part of the game which is actually fun for them.

What it all boils down to, is i understand where you're coming from. I don't want to give an impression that i'm just some butthurt ignorant moron who wants to bash a game he didn't like while ignoring the good things about it (even if those good things are not really good things for me personally).

Ok then. The "quality" points were just examples of what i am looking for in rpg related games, not any particular things i was missing in Skyrim in general. Ingenuity, creativity, no holding back, choices and consequences.

If a game goes with the "by the book" it's not as much a detriment as it is a missed opportunity to craft something great. I've played enough games to get my "generic example of a particular setting" fix to go by them without wincing and knowing i won't lose much if i don't finish, or even play, them.

Let's go back to Morrowind for a minute here, that game had so much fun with it's setting! Stilt riders, houses build in hollowed out shells of dead bugs, chitin armor, houses built in trees, overflow of folklore and tiny little details which made the whole experience genuine. And despite the plot being fairly generic, they did make a good job of throwing in stuff like racial and cultural tensions, Dark Elven disillusion with where they are politically speaking, clinging on to archaic traditions just out of spite for the alien cultures invading their homeland. It would take me way too much time to highlight all that shit, but you get the gist of it. They put so much effort into making it all seem as fleshed out as possible, just for the sake of validating the setting. I missed that in Oblivion, and i miss that in Skyrim (although to a much lesser extent, they really got their shit together in that one).

For me it looks like you soak in the atmosphere. The way the immediate setting is portrayed via general writing, dialogues and lore is a huge part of the atmosphere for me, and it's hard for me to understand people who can get by without it. I can get lost in thought while watching the beautiful skyboxes and reading codex entries in Mass Effect, but that won't get me through the entire game.

However, you are correct in that there is no right or wrong here. I am hugely biased against the newschool way of making crpg games, and the unholy trinity of Oblivion/Fallout 3/Skyrim will always stand tall as a testiment of how not to make a crpg for me, as they lack the basic traits i need to enjoy my role playing experience.

They are, like i said before, a different beast altogether. I just wish people would stop fawning over every one of the like they're the second coming of Christ. Honestly, the hype aggravates me more than the games itself.

well, personal preference is really something that is kind of fixed for each person and i don't see a need to change my or others perception of games.

yes, atmosphere.
when i track back why i consider fallout 1/2 as my "alltime muffins" it's not that simple to explain. it touched me personally and caused tears and smiles at the same time, like on the border between a sweet nightmare and a dark dream.i always had post-apocalyptic visions like towns/buildings/places remain destroyed or deserted and i still love that chaotic and inspiring approach or a whole "alternative" very much. as a kid i was far from a loner, but it always was interesting to see that people's dreams contain beaches and sun and mine always were like a dark reality.

my first playthroughs always were like kill some people if i want to, even questgivers and shit, so it can't be the plot or the writing that sucked me in :P. more like possibilities in this alternate reality.

for me fallout nw had the same effect, i think it was cause the world seemed compelling to me compared to f3.


when i think of other games like that then jagged alliance 2 comes to my mind which i tried to play some months ago again.
and now after years there is some big community overhaul and stuff, which makes the game actually to some hardcore weapon or armyporn. i played it and hated it. and again i had to think back what made this good to me in the old days. and it was alwys bizarr stuff like on this beautiful island with all the villages and shit there was a cave where some alienbrut was killing the inhabitants. well, that's stuff i memorize more than anything else.


so you see it's always about personal taste.


i thought morrowind was good and all, but the fantasy world, with all it's peacefulness couldnt drag me much into it after getting to darker places of my mind through games before. it was just not weird enough for a complete different world, you know. but i ofc have no problem if people liked the complexity and whatnot. it just isnt my nature.


skyrim is definitely not "my" setting, but thinking about it from a neutral standpoint, it's a needed or inevitable step forward for games in terms of gearing all the aspects that people like together to make it compelling and rich of beauty.

It sounds like you were describing some of the "infinite" quests, rather than the core quests. The infinite quests will generally be the typical fedex, but I've found that the core quests have been extremely fun/creative/rewarding.

Have you done the dark brotherhood/thieves guild/mages college/companions/imperials/stormcloaks yet? Any of the smaller faction stuff like vampires/werewolves/cannibals/etc?

Admittedly, i've skipped on a lot of the content just to get a good grip on the game. I'll be catching up on it later as i have more time.

Honestly though, does any of it elevate itself above the "passable" line? I've did a few of the Thieves Guild and Winterhold quests and they all seemed pretty straightforward. Yeah it's way fucking better than what Oblivion had, but i found it tedious nonetheless. Didn't hit the small faction stuff yet.

The thieves guild wasn't so great, but I had a lot more fun with the winterhold, and the dark brotherhood. Additionally, lesser members of the factions will give you major quests, but you generally have to ask for them, rather than being given them straight out.

Some of the infinite quests will seem like important quests when you first get them, but those are the "generic" quests. Some of the infinite quests are pretty fun, though.

pretty much agree with your whole post.. its just too bad there's nothing else to choose from, these days games are about polygon count :/

Eh. It's honestly much better than i expected. I approach every single new game released with extreme wariness and every Bethesda title since Morrowind with disdain, but it way surpassed my expectations.

It's playable and, in parts, enjoyable. I'm not sure there are other recent mainstream rpg titles which could challenge even that (Witcher 2 and Mass Effect 3 when it's released, maybe?).

Hey, beggars can't be choosers, right? Can always fall back on the trusty indie titles or just go back to the classics.

I've seen and read quite a number of reviews. Most of them tell similar stories of a game that has been done before, albeit perhaps slightly better. Overall, nothing new, and as others have stated, pretty mediocre.

btw: is the game always that dark or is there a lack of lighting models in night scenes?

Better than Oblivion, its alright I guess.

Mods will make the game 100x better, I'll be waiting until then

like xerxuss the super modder implements some cool stronghold and a 5min quest. i'm pretty pumped

strafe jumping mod would be nice...

I loved to play Gothic series.
This games is super! I would rate it 9.5/10

so if skyrim is such a huge succes they will donate some money to ql amirite? :D

I dont know how to play rpg games... all i do is killing everyone and stealing as much as possible... Although it is kinda fun.

you murdering thief.

when i steal something and someone notices it i kill them and everybody that notices me killing them....

So you play it like GTA... or cooller.

i don't like GTA :/

you could try to pretend you are a noble yet racist knight that must kill all dark elves and dump their looted goods at homes of argonians

but really all the RPGness comes from the quests, dont really have to rp yourself

i am playing as that lizzard dunno the name of the race :/. I find it kinda boring and slow, so i like to spice it ;)

or you could go to an island where all the hippie redguard loving kids hang and shoot them.

So far it looks better than Oblivion but still no match to Morrowind.

Morrowind is pathetic crap compared to Daggerfall

daggerfall sucks compared to pen and paper

pen and paper suck compared to finger and poop

1/10

1/10

Arena etc etc

I thought one of the intentions of Radiant Storytelling was to downsize the amount of pointless essential NPCs. Every named asshole Stormcloak or Forsworn won't die, I can't even raid a camp without having to constantly kill the same guy over and over.

There is also a way overabundance of Dragons, killing them is trivial but it's tedious as fuck after so many.

Dragons are way too trivial for sure, they're 1 hit kills (the first time they land on the ground) with many different setups. Just doesn't feel epic after the first few when your character is weaker.

you can always play on a higher difficulty if you want a real challenge. dragons are far from trivial on master.
or are you simply judging the dragons strength compared to other enemies?

If you use your alchemy and smithing skills right, even master is trivial.

yes, that made me actually "finish" the game now =/ (-alchemy, +enchanting)

Alchemy+enchanting is the key to absurd stats. Make +enchanting potion with alchemy, enchant gear with +alchemy stats, wear gear with +alchemy stats and make new +enchanting potion, repeat... With absurdly high +alchemy gear, you can make godly +enchanting or +smithing potions, and the bonuses count over 100 skill.

So don't break the game.

try fighting an ancient dragon, they pretty tough

also draugr deathlords are fuckin hardmen

First Deathlord I fought was pretty tough yeah, didn't expect them to be able to shout, but, they're 1 hit kills now with high sneak and one hand skill. x15 multiplier with a good dagger is so strong, if I added the ridiculous potions the thing would probably disintegrate in 1 hit.

giants you say? stamina drain with cold spells, kite after for like.. a few mins. dead giant at even low level mages.

game's a blast. playing as two-handed badass warrior .. rawwwrr. just hit lvl 20, losley following main quests, riding around looking for dragon words :E

I'm enjoying the game quite a lot.

I have though a main game design critique regarding this kind of world (bethesda open world), which in my opinion misses what I would call a "good use of locality".

Take a game like Gothic. When you start the game you stay in the safe area around where you initially start. You are free to go to more dangerous areas (the guards will warn you but still let you pass), but in there you will find orks sentries, powerful beasts and so on, and likely die. Staying on the roads, not going out at night, etc is actually important.
The effect of such design is that you will get to know the safe areas, solve things internally, develop, and finally reach the moment where you are powerful enough can enter the next areas. This gives the player a great feel of accomplishment.

Similarly, a game like Ultima, has the top of the world with cities and villages which is relatively safe, and then dungeons that go deeper and deeer, the deeper the more dangerous. Again a player will have to 'conquer' the deep areas, seeing a progression and feeling very good about this.

I think locality is important as it makes you appreciate the individual parts of the world much more. I go to a city, and would like to find local quests. A game like Risen 2 solves this by presenting to the player islands. Since you start with no boat, you are stuck there until you can actually go to the next one. The effect is that you solve all quest/puzzles locally, and meanwhile build anticipation to that other island you hear about but you cannot go yet. It gives you a purpose on clearing a location to aquire enough skill / exp / gold whatever to get to the next location.

Skyrim lacks this 'growth'. Right from the start you can find quests that will point you to the other side of the world. 50 coins to a truck, you arrive to a city totally far away, then do a 2 min walk you reach the target location... like seriously? I just started to know Riverwood... The effect is that most people don't even know the name of the cities they go to, as all they care is to fast travel the closest to the location they need to get to. This limits the emotional attachment to the places, as every place is mainly a mean to go somewhere else.

Now one could say that , since it is a free open world, a player can try to play with his own locallity enforcements. But this is only half a satisfaction, as then one has to keep quests opened, not getting that part of the satisfaction.
Maybe they could have gone in this direction by making certain locations really dangerous and warning the player that that is the case. I feel though that this is a major design decision and that it would probably be better to rethink the whole thing rather than try and fix it.

Things like fast travel are an option. You don't have to use them, but they are there for those who do. If you simply do your quests as you get to them, you'll have a much better time.

Sure, but the fact it is there and uber tempting will result in 99% of the user base using it and getting whatever experience that prescribes. That is how the game will be remembered. In a game design perspective, that is a central feature around which most of the game is based. Other developers opted for alternatives that imho bring advantages.

What is wrong with them using it? If they want to use it, let them. Forcing them not to would be more wrong, as not everybody has the time, or patience, to make the long trek.

I'm just observing how the game mechanics works by having tons of quests pointing all over the place, which is strictly connected to having a fast travel. It is a core design decision, with no simple shallow fix.

As I said I think the game loses the "conquering" of the areas which I experienced in other games.

I know one can self impose rules, but that is marginal in this discussion. What is the value of self imposed rules while judging a game? If you discuss CA, what is the value of saying "yeah but people could stop rocketjumping, or not use lg all the time"?

I know one can self impose rules, but that is marginal in this discussion.

How is it? The game is a sandbox game, so it's entirely about your own rules.

Not entirely. Many things are fixed. Anyways I can't make my point more clear than this.

Nevertheless, by choosing to make something default or not you (as a developer) greatly influence how the game will be played.

You raise an interesting point, I love Gothic games and Risen (much much more than Morrowind/Oblivion etc) and while I think Skyrim is a vast improvement over Oblivion, it's still not as good to me as Gothic/Risen.

I am 15 lvl now in skyrim (playing on adempt level), didn't played other TES games before. This game have A LOT MORE good shit then Gothic (And gothic is my number 1 game of all time). So much secret places, so much easter eggs , so big world, you can take so much items and so on. Ofcors I don't like this "When you start the game you stay in the safe area around where you initially start. You are free to go to more dangerous areas (the guards will warn you but still let you pass), but in there yo....".
I don't like shit like enemy leveling, gothic system is best, but as I told, this game looks even better...

locality was best implemented in morrowind. there was only fast travel between the few mage guild locations and that would cost money. other means of transport included boats and silt striders and you could only travel from one place to the few neighbouring ones, not the other side of the map. so in order to reach some remote location you'd have to use several means of transport and spend quite a bit of money.

roaming around the countryside was dangerous. you could get killed by a rat, for example. :)

also finding things was better because you'd get a detailed description in the journal, but no compass and pointers. here it's follow arrow-> kill baddies-> return loot.

Anyone tried it on ps3?

Low fps, bad graphics and occasional crashes :(
Still fun though.

sounds like a no-go :/

Shitty console port.

IMHO - GOTY without question. My days have turned into "can I go and play Skyrim yet???"

The scariest part is that there are so many quests, that once you're bored with your mage alchemy cat woman, you can start a new fists-only orc character, or a nord knight, or a lizard thief, etc etc etc... And so many "co-main" quests, such as db, etc

Is unarmed actually viable? I didn't see any perks that would help, and I haven't come across any fists/claws or such.

Heavy Armor at skill 30 adds the armor rating of your gauntlets as unarmed damage. There's a modifier for the glove slot that adds flat (I think) unarmed damage. Plus I think the perk for attack speed while dual-wielding from one-handed, also applies to unarmed as well.

Ah sweet. I hadn't done any heavy armor yet, so I didn't know the perks. Does unarmed still have killing blow animations and such?

Not sure if there are animations actually, I've not tried it out much.

I found some enchanted unarmed gloves or something somewhere that did quite a lot of unarmed damage for some reason or other. that should clear things up.

Ah,

Gloves of the Pugilist: Additional 10 points of damage to unarmed strikes.

I had those!

Oh yeah, I think those drop in the ratway.

My khajit mage has claws, I don't know how much it helps unarmed. Unarmed is pretty cool, there's actually heavy armor perks I think that help unarmed, if nothing else.

The one thing I haven't figured out yet is how to block while unarmed :D

Plus with just shouts you can be a viable unarmed char

I just realized you can only equip one ring at a time, the whole game thus far I've been thinking I was getting bonuses for two and being frustrated when rings were apparently unequipping themselves.

Wtf Bethesda?

one ring to rule them all!

scumbag skyrim: runs perfect on first playthrough, keeps crashing when I want to make a new character

if you guys were given a million dollars, you'd still bitch about not having enough money.

had the same problem. common fix till they patch it:

unpack 'Skyrim - VoicesExtra.bsa' with this into your /data folder. will create a new folder 'sound' with esbern's voice files.quest should work now again ;)

i got error messages while unpacking - just ignored them. works.

Aye :D

played quite a bit and yeah, its quite good game with good fraction quests and some interesting random quests here and there, but after 2 days of playing I just didnt opened the game next day, guess Im getting too old for this

so much wrong with this game...

-you're faster than everyone from the start, with the exception of maybe mountain cats you can just outrun whoever the fuck you want.

-items don't deteriorate

- shops- all shops carry the same shit you do, literally. there's no incentive to have money because there's NOTHING to buy. even books that mages sell are dependant on your exact level at certain magic school.

armors - probably the worst thing in the game, if you want to have any sort of armor you need to make it yourself. I'm a mage I don't want to hammer fucking metal plates at a fucking forge for 5 hrs. that was always availible at shops. also you'd expect to find boss characters in rich cities wearing something better than steel, but no. everyone wears only steel.

loot - unlock master level lock - get iron mace

lockpicking - you can unlock master locks with level 1 and enough lockpicks. I really want to upgrade those lockpicking perks now.

enchanting - to reach level 100 - petty gem + rags + boost destruction. repeat x1000. so interesting.

staffs - can't make them, can't disenchant them.

master difficulty - kill dungeon boss easily then get insta killed by a common bandit with a hunting bow. yeah, that really helps immersion bethesda.

deadra - where are all the golden saints, deadric lords, storm attronachs?

bugs - way too many to mention.

basically you got no incentive to keep playing because you can't get anything that's more than 1 level above you. I want to find a fucking deadric hammer and lose all my stamina after 1 swing, I want to buy an uber spellbook for 100000$ and not have enough magicka to cast it. fuck you bethesda and consoles.

Ye, pretty much nailed it. Although I liked the game overall, it got so many things to improve. Ended up with 200K gold and nowhere to spend it properly :X

if you want to have any sort of armor you need to make it yourself. I'm a mage I don't want to hammer fucking metal plates at a fucking forge for 5 hrs.

If you're a mage, there is absolutely no reason to be using blacksmithing at all. You should be using alchemy and enchanting.

that was always availible at shops.

The perk of blacksmithing isn't the ability to craft armor - that's just a bonus to get things cheaper than a shop would sell. The real benefit of blacksmithing is the weapon/armor upgrade system.

loot - unlock master level lock - get iron mace

It doesn't happen very often, but it's hard enough to sell goods as it is - I wouldn't want more expensive gear.

lockpicking - you can unlock master locks with level 1 and enough lockpicks. I really want to upgrade those lockpicking perks now.

You can cast spells as a warrior, too. Perks are not meant to define your character, they are meant to simply make you better at what you want to do.

deadra - where are all the golden saints, deadric lords, storm attronachs?

The golden saints are in the shivering isles, so I don't know why you'd expect to see them. Daedric lords and storm atronachs are both in the game.

basically you got no incentive to keep playing because you can't get anything that's more than 1 level above you. I want to find a fucking deadric hammer and lose all my stamina after 1 swing, I want to buy an uber spellbook for 100000$ and not have enough magicka to cast it.

Actually, there are plenty of static items that are throughout the world, which can be obtained regardless of your current level. If you don't explore, you're not going to find them.

If you're a mage, there is absolutely no reason to be using blacksmithing at all. You should be using alchemy and enchanting.

maybe I dont want to get killed with a single arrow. mages are supposed to wear none or light armor, here I wear heavy because there's absolutely no reason not to.

The perk of blacksmithing isn't the ability to craft armor - that's just a bonus to get things cheaper than a shop would sell. The real benefit of blacksmithing is the weapon/armor upgrade system.

you can't get better armors any other way other than making them. I've only ever found one armor set (dwarwen) and that was when I already had better stuff. after you get dwarwen you might occasionally find orkish or glass, but rarely. you won't find deadric, or dragonbone fragments. ever.

It doesn't happen very often, but it's hard enough to sell goods as it is - I wouldn't want more expensive gear.

I do. I want shops to have that one item that costs a gazzilion$ that I couldn't possibly have. makes me keep playing and return when I have money or something to trade. also I want shops in a rich city to have better stuff than some shitty hut in the middle of nowhere.

maybe I dont want to get killed with a single arrow. mages are supposed to wear none or light armor, here I wear heavy because there's absolutely no reason not to.

Never happened to me. Mages should be using robes with +magicka/+regen/-% spell cost. You either aren't using a ward spell, aren't using stoneskin, or have never leveled up your health. That's not a fault of the game, it's just a consequence of the way that you play. There really is no reason to level your magicka over 300, but if you want to play as a glass cannon, you should expect to get one-shot by arrows.

you can't get better armors any other way other than making them. I've only ever found one armor set (dwarwen) and that was when I already had better stuff. after you get dwarwen you might occasionally find orkish or glass, but rarely. you won't find deadric, or dragonbone fragments. ever.

You can most certainly find daedric and dragon items - what level are you?

I do. I want shops to have that one item that costs a gazzilion$ that I couldn't possibly have. makes me keep playing and return when I have money or something to trade. also I want shops in a rich city to have better stuff than some shitty hut in the middle of nowhere.

I was commenting on the issue of drops from chests - since you complained that a master locked chest gave you a shitty item. I have enough trouble trying to sell all my shit as it is.

I finished the main quest after probably around 30-40 hours of dicking around with sidequests and shit.

Honestly, it was good, but kind of disappointing. The main quest was cool, but felt really short. I wasn't expecting to end as quickly as it did, and now that I've finished that I've kind of lost interest in playing the rest of the game. Haven't uninstalled or deleted my saves yet, but I haven't touched it in about a week now either.

I don't know about game of the year. Its obviously an amazing game, but I enjoyed Portal 2 a shitload more.

It's kinda fun at the start, the nice (modded) graphics and the open world was impressive at the beginning, but I stopped playing without even finishing the main quest:/

The game was so easy even on the hardest level, that I just lost motivation, because it became repetitive and boring after a while (approx 60 hours).

Dragons are hopeless, you can stand still front of them and just keep clicking, and they will die before you lose less than half of your hp. You need a few healing potions for the stronger bosses, but not much. Perhaps the tedious mission of escorting and saving your dumb partner was the only thing what i found hard sometimes.

My last save file is from 11.11.16 and I don't think I will ever continue:S It's hard to enjoy when there is simply no challenge at all, the game is just not fun in an adventure only mode.

because it became repetitive and boring after a while

Yep. This is the exact reason I stopped playing before completing the main quest and have no intention of ever playing it again. It really wowed me at first but it just became extremely tedious.

it's got pretty mountains, but it's flat. knowwatimean