You cant because different scroll mechanism.

Plz share your knowledges about this sir, i'd like to make a mod with a IMO1.1a shape+a good sensor.
So long.

this is a problem, but I will try to solve it

Doesn't the Kinzu have like the same shape as the WMO? I heard that DA innards go inside very easily.

^^

STFU kinzu srsly :(

I want to try to do it,
wmo 1.1a + da sensor.
I already had a successful experience
Imperator + DA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8EOnbmqvZ4
MX518 & 500 + DA http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1h1AXFIwNs

Interesting @ MX518 + DA.

How many of the buttons did you get to work?

I'm assuming you never got the scroll wheel to work?

working mouse 1-5, scroll does not work for scrolling.
Here is the beginning of my ideas on how to do to scroll wmo 1.1a
http://piccy.info/view3/1383287/1914f6aad1145f8c7393a1ef72117d93/
http://piccy.info/view3/1383293/e3d57bf4812f9eec103b02402cb39a20/
http://piccy.info/view3/1383295/165803913da9c7f3a3cb23eb365d217f/
http://piccy.info/view3/1383298/0dee8150fabf0fcfbe49e2ff349286a3/
http://piccy.info/view3/1383299/f45deb7889d7ce44fe3e5cd320ba30ba/

awesome! i will try to make imo1.1a (same motherboard than wmo or close one) + good sensor. looking forward to your work sir :)

Good stuff. :)

How did you attached wires? I mean show us pin connection arrangements and some pictures.

I have foto the first version, http://piccy.info/view3/1383331/aa34cf5c127de3b8d172c197e65669ff/

in more detail later

So scroll wheel does not work?

@ MX518 + DA scroll does not work
I'll try to fix it later. But the chance is small, and they require bold action

o well without scroll wheel working its useless :p

In the game I do not want to scroll. For work I have other mouse.

I'd definitely appreciate more detailed pics of your MX518/DA mod.

I want to undertake making one of my own next week.
Your pics will help a lot.

Cheers.

http://img27.imageshack.us/g/img1101nn.jpg/

1 -
2 -
3 - blue mouse4-5
4 - red mouse1-3
5 - black mouse1-3
6 - white mouse1-3
7 - yelow mouse4-5
8 -
9 -
10 - black m4-5 + yelow m1-3

Beautiful!

Thank you, thank you, thank you. :D

Did you get the little DPI switch at the front to work as well, btw?

No, but it can be done

as he uses rev.2 PCB, here are the differences between rev.2 and rev.3 PCB's like "toop" posted once in the kinzuadder thread:

Razer DA rev.2 PCB pins
1:
2: scroll 1/0: scroll jump indicator | bottom scrollpin
3:
4: button1
5: button2
6: scrollbutton
7:
8: Scroll direction | middle scollpin
9:
10: -/gnd




Razer DA rev.3 PCB pins
1:
2: Scroll direction | middle scollpin
3:
4: scrollbutton
5: button2
6: button1
7:
8: scroll 1/0: scroll jump indicator | bottom scrollpin
9:
10: -/gnd

Hey, thuNDa, thanks for clearing that up.

Where can I see what revision I have?

open it up and u see if ur PCB looks like the one from spicke, or if it looks different.

Well, I did my attempt on soldering the DA PCB today.

I failed miserably, and even ended up destroying one of the pins.

What I don't get is how you guys solder these tiny, tiny connectors (pins)...

The slacks from the molten soldering wire are so huge here that they almost always overlap, and connect the holes/connectors next to them. :/

How do you make the molten wire slacks so tiny?

Also, what did you do with the pins/holes themselves before soldering wires to them?

I see on spicke's pics that he must have drilled the 10 pin holes out?
How did you manage that?

I tried with needles, while holding the soldering iron to the other end of the same pin (to warm it up so the needle could get pushed through).
But it all ended up so messy that I destroyed one of the pins completely. And that's when I gave up and came crying to you here. :x

Any tips?

Thanks.

Soldering is not as easy as one may think, and i personally destroyed alot too while i was learning it.

You need the right tools and you need the right technique, with the right know-how.

Tools:
-heat adjustable soldering-station
-small soldering tip
-desolder pump
-third hand
-the right solder tin(also thin enough)

know-how:
-clean the tip often while u solder
-not too much heat!!!
-take a little bit of solder to the tip, then go to the contact
-heat the pin and the contact together and hold the tin from the other side to the contact and wait until it flows between them

desoldering:
-not too much heat!!!
-use the desoldiering pump to get the contacts/holes free of tin
-again take a little tin to the tip and go to the contact, then take the pump near to it, and while u remove the tip u press the pump, and the hole should be free

Probably you destroyed the contact because of too much heat.
But if its only off from one side, you still can use the contact of the other side.

Heh..... I all have is a cheap soldering iron, cost like 12 euros.

I did file the tip on it so it was very thin and pointy.

But have no control of the heat. And I've never even heard of a desoldering pump.

I guess I was foolish, thinking that just because I had soldered some of the OMRON microswitches to some other frankenmice I've done in that past that I could solder these tiny pins on the DA PCB.
Those are so microscopic that I stand in awe of you guys who have manged to solder them properly.
You must have used a magnifying glass as well?

I still don't understand how you were able to make holes in the pins. I mean, remove all the old cable/solder in them from the factory.

u heat up the contact from the bottom and pull out the wire.
Then u have a hole which is filled with tin.
U heat that up, and suck it out with the desolder vakuum pump.

i got such soldering station: http://www.amazon.com/Stahl-Tools-Variable-Te...amp;sr=8-8

and using it at 12 o'clock heat

the solder i use is 0,75mm thick and Sn95,5Ag3,8Cu0 and has 3,5% flux

desoldering pump i use like this:
http://www.amazon.com/Parts-Express-Solder-Su...amp;sr=1-1

and i wouldn't want to solder again without this tool:
http://www.amazon.com/Helping-Hand-with-Magni...amp;sr=1-2


this shows some usefull things: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8UN3D2-f64A&feature=related

Cheers, thuNDa.

I think I'll get me those items you posted, and start learning to solder properly before I try with my 2nd DA board.

Thank you.

You dont have enough equipment and you start modding. lol
Now you are stuck and messed pcbs. I always told you you will fuck it up big time.

You need to read and read again.. what tools you need.. practice on some pcbs... watch youtube videos read reviews. Listen what everyone saying about their mod. How they did it (not just looking at pictures). How all buttons works how scroll wheel works. Which connections goes where. But NO.. you dont do anything above.

You just dont wake up and start modding because its just soldering. Its very very easy but it can be so hard.. if you dont know what to do and how to do.

I wish to extend my deepest and most sincere apologies to you, for not being the world champion of mouse modding that you so obviously are.

I stand in awe of your presence.

My sheer arrogance in attempting this mouse mod is shameful and utterly disgraceful to say the least.

How dare I engage in such a giant feat, when all I had done previously was making 5 frankenmice in the past (where everything worked out flawlessly)

I truly hope you can - in time - forgive me.

I humbly await your forgiveness...

For MxAdder I used this version of the DeathAdder
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5nBiqkVBI4&am...page#t=90s
When I was doing ImpeAdder I had a version http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to-change...sassembly/
Soldering was not easy, I'm a bit shallow drill holes extended.
Quick guide as I did ImpeAdder http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8EOnbmqvZ4

Oh boy, if I only had that MxAdder version of the DA PCB, that would have been a walk in the park, lol.

Is that the old, old DA version?

How did you manage to drilling of the pin holes on your imperator mod?

Just tiny drillbits?

wtf?
are u talkin about the pinholes, where the cable to the button PCB was before?

Yes, I replied to him before I read your message.

You explained you 'sucked' them out. I understand. Thank you.

It had not previously occurred to me that you could suck it out.

I'm just a bit worried about heating it up too much, and thus destroying the board.

So maybe a tiny drillbit would solve it. Just a thought.

If you use the right temperature, u can touch the contact almost till eternity before it breaks off.
the key with such temperature is, to take a bit tin to the tip which works as heattransporter.
It takes longer, but ur on the safe side.

Thank you.

Hello, Today I made WMO-Adder, working scroll and all button. Detailed pictures are coming soon. ;)

eager to see this :)

Well done! Many will appreciate your work!

Scroll working, too?
w00t!

You rock.

i think i've posted pics of my logitech wingman with deathadder 1800 dpi optics inside some time ago. non-prediction firmware, tracking is flawless.

Could you link us up with those pics?

sure.

some talk and guide to do it:

http://www.esreality.com/index.php?a=post&...pid1869222

bigger pictures:

http://www.esreality.com/index.php?a=post&...pid1869228

edit: the old version with the 3.0 sensor needed a good cloth pad for optimal tracking, perhaps because the sensor was positioned ~1 mm farther inside the shell than it should have been. it also needed ms intellipoint drivers to assign a function to the middle mouse button.

there's nothing like that with the new version using the DA sensor. pad is a puretrak talent, but it tracks on pretty much everything.

it doesn't need the razer driver, the middle mouse button works without it. though i have still installed the driver because of some games that have only a slider for setting mouse sens and the leftmost position is too fast already. lowering sens in the razer driver doesn't produce accel, while doing this in the windows mouse panel does.

Nice work, man.
That's a beauty you got there.

The Wingman mouse was good for a claw mouse because the sensor (ball in this case) was placed relatively far in front. That made is very responsive, despite being so small.

The CM Spawn Storm would have been the perfect replacement for the old Wingman. But sadly they decided to place the sensor waaaaaaaay in the back, making the mouse aim like a brick.

as i said in that thread, i didn´t make it myself, i´m not skilled enough. luckily i know an electrician who did that for me. sure there are other good mice out there, i have that frankenmouse and also a xai connected to my pc since no wheel on the wingman sucks for browsing, and i can play tactical shooters well with the xai, but for arcade shooters it´s too heavy for my taste. there´s also the fact that i´m used with this shape with 3 main buttons (primary fire / walk forward / secondary fire or iron sights in my setup) since 1996 (mouseman96 back then) and don´t feel like changing for the bit of gaming i do today.

as for the ball / now sensor being placed farther in front, this means one has to move his wrist less. the grip is also comfortable since the broad shape imitates the shape of the hand, i hold the mouse between thumb and pinky, and being very light i barely feel it. being flat, the mouse´s rear doesn´t bump against the palm, throwing off the aim sometimes. anyway, this is all a matter of personal preference, but iirc you praised the wingman shape in some post, so i´m sure you understand that ;)

i also linked to this post on the logitech forums asking for an optical wingman, but i doesn´t look like they´re going to make one, or maybe sell the shape patent to someone else.

as for wmo-adder, isn´t this the zowie ec1 / ec2? same sensor, or similar in performance.

I think Logitech tried to somewhat imitate the WingMan shape with their 9x mouse.
There is a slight likeness to it.

But the three button thing I doubt they would dare to try in 2011.
We have a whole new generation of kids that grew up with mice having mouse wheels. That middle button would confuse them, and sales would suffer, I'm afraid.

I would buy one for sure, though. :)

I think that for ergonomical reaons not many of the wingman fans would fancy a mouse without a mousewheel nowadays. browsing has become so much easier due to mousewheels.

also I have weapons bound to both MWHEELUP and MWHEELDOWN...

maybe at the first look, the g9 looks like the wingman, but actually the size is a whole lot different.
Wingman is very small, while the G9 has a mid size of todays mice, not to speak about the weight, which is a ton at the G9.

for sure. hence i proposed a modernised wingman with a wheel between the left and the middle button in that post on the logitech forums. perhaps these 2 buttons need to be stretched by a few mm to compensate for the place taken by the wheel, and the right button made a bit narrower, needs some testing i think. also 2 additional buttons on the sides. as i said, i have 2 mice connected to my pc for this reason, scrolling without a wheel is impractical, and many gamers have weaponswitch and other commands bound to the wheel.

however, with such adaptation, there's no reason for not introducing the basic shape again.

as for the g9, it's halfway similar because it's a short mouse, very good for claw / finger grip. unfortunately it's heavy for its size. the wingman-frankenmouse on the other hand is really light, haven't weighed it but it's nothing more than a plastic shell and a circuit board.

WMO-Adder http://img855.imageshack.us/g/img1123n.jpg/

I would pay good money for one of those!

best mouse ever ? :O

You could have push the pcb back for few mm that would save you cutting Deathadder pcb which can be very risky to kill DA.

Both mice (WMO/DA) havent got their sensor exactly in the center they are few mm ahead of center so it wouldnt matter if you push pcb back a little bit.

Modded scroll might break if you are heavy user of M3 but as long as you use good it wont break.

Overall great work just few niggles which can sort out in next mod.

I would like the sensor exactly where he is at WMO.
Quality turned out to scroll pretty reliable no worse than the DA.
At the moment, this combination of WMO + DA sensor for me personally it seems flawless.Excellent balance of weight, shape, sensor...

Fantastic work, spicke.

Many would say you now own the perfect mouse. :)

Congratulations.

Make 100 WMO-Adders--->sell them for 90$----> be rich XD

update
wmo-adder 1.01 :)
Revised: lowered slightly below the sensor, the current response distances 1-1.5 cd, before that there were fewer 1cd, I am not very comfortable.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RO__y2ZuhDg&am...lpage#t=1s

nice work, can we see a fleshed out guide?

I have a question for someone who did Mx518 Frankenmouse.

I want to know all colors for Mouse1, M2, M3, Dpi (+) switch and ground.
And scroll wheel with 2 pin and 3 pin transistor colors.

If you know pin arrangement for Mouse 4/5 and ground too.

Thanks in advance. Appreciate if anyone helps.

make wingman mouse with tumb button, scrollwheel and DA sensor (red LED for LOD) and be rich in no time

hello all
I completed the MxAdder Final 3.5g (working scroll) and the MitsumiAdder.
If you're interested, I can lay out a detailed photo report.
http://piccy.info/view3/2603495/51a1015801e43f3eac5a8c08e87e5c4c/

I had a mitsumi http://piccy.info/view3/2603504/8ad6c2d0adabb5c5c5fa62edf2809690/ for this mod

MitsumiAdder
http://img832.imageshack.us/slideshow/webplay...116729.jpg
http://imageshack.us/g/832/34116729.jpg/

that looks so sexy

I realize this was a long time ago, but could you pls make a guide on how to make the MitsumiAdder? I would greatly appreciate it :)

Mxadder 3.5g final mod
http://img141.imageshack.us/slideshow/webplay...938964.jpg
http://imageshack.us/g/141/30938964.jpg/

insane :O

must be the most complicated mousemod there is.

Can You provide wiring scheme to scroll? I did mxadder which is based on 1800dpi version like 2.5 year ago. I havent wired my scroll because mx had broken scroll sensor and comparing da scroll mechanism to mxs one i havent seen easy and nice way to do it. In addition i used to life without scroll. Second thing do You have problem with cursor jumping/jitter after conversion?

He used another scrollwheel encoder as you can see in the pics.
About jitter and cursorjumping after finishing the mod, did you use a "dremel" to cut the PCB?
If so, i can imagine that the sensor is now full of dust inside.
I had the same problem when cutting the DA PCB with uncovered sensor chip.
You can open the sensor tho, and clean it.
I took the "needle" from a circle-drawer to lever the thing open.

Thx for reply. I havent touch main pcb, just desolder ribbon cable from supporting razer pcb with buttons and connect them to cables from mx button pcb like on this pic:
http://img24.imageshack.us/img24/505/damx1.jpg

It looks terrible because it was temporary solution and i wanted to solder pins connector and did a proper connector to made it look like factor mouse. But like other temporary solutions it become permanent.
I was careful about sensor and any dust which could access to it. I havent opened sensor and i thought i could screw it and put more dust by opening it than got rid with problem. I accuse my goliathus control and his texture or/and not ideal placing of sensor.

no, if you did not dremel, than it is very unlikely that the problem might be caused from dust, and you shouldn't open the sensor then(destroyed one of them by opening :)).

Sits the lens right at the bottom, or have you set it above the shape which is meant for the logitech lens?

BTW, just get a G400, no more need for mxadders. :P

You made me to open my mouse and clean all dirt. I use to clean lens pretty often, but i didnt expect so much dust around lens inside mouse. I even opened sensor and checked for any dust under 5 times magnifier. I changed 2 side tape to new one and added one more extra layer which caused change lod distance to lower. Long time a go i was testing higher lod but i didnt like it, just coudnt aim. But now after removed all dust, added one layer of tape i suppose i found perfect place for sensor. I can sound like voodoo magic but mouse reaction and behave changed drastic to plus. Now everything is under control. Crosshair moves are sharp, precise, just railing is pure sex. It doesnt jump anymore. Just one map to use to new better aiming and i started hit shitload of flick rails again.

Could You tell me hows g400 (i suppose u are talking about version with no angle snaping) compare to second revision of DA 1800dpi (this one with permanent solder ribbon cable between pcbs)? I bet that quality of g400 is same level like old mx which is kinda rock solid. My mouse is based on one of firsts mx 518 which came on market. So its like 7yo. Da which since first day makes strange noise when i pressed down top of case, but it wasnt problem because i had known that i was going to make damx before i got da.

Anyway i use da stock lens and opening of sensor was kinda ez. Heres pics of my damx
http://img689.imageshack.us/img689/2630/damx2.jpg
http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/2663/damx3.jpg
http://img191.imageshack.us/img191/9632/damx4.jpg
http://img571.imageshack.us/img571/1310/damx5.jpg

nice that it is better now.
with the sensor opening, i meant opening the sensor-chip itself.
That you can see the inside of it, but you don't need to do this anyways.

The non-anglesnapping G400 (at 800DPI) feels the same as the DA 3G for me, but has a lower LOD.
with this, you can get the LOD as low as you want: http://www.overclock.net/t/1211083/tape-trick...tical-mice

With the cursor I have no problems.
To scroll to the first version I have worked only in cliques.
The latest version of the picture shows it.
I went to a bold step, but in the end everything turned out perfectly.
I really like the new scroll. In the original mx518 it is much coarser.

I fixed cursor problem.
I was asking about pinpoints, because id like to know which one i should connect to make it work properly. If You could tell me which pin point on mx pcb is scoll direction and which one scroll jump indicator.

Hello everyone. I was inspired by your modifications to make my own wmo-adder but i am facing few problems.
First i can't figure out pin layout on wmo 1.1, so i don't know which pin to connect to pins on DA pcb. I just couldn't figure out that by looking at pictures posted on this thread. I uploaded picture of both pcbs and i humbly ask for some idle soul to connect right pins using ms paint or similar program,so i could know where to solder wires.
Second i am not sure if my DA is rev 2 or rev 3. I think it is rev 3 but i would like someone to confirm this based on photo i am providing.
Third problem is that i solderd wire to 4th pin on DA and than tried all possible solutions on wmo pcb and clicked on left mouse and scroll mouse button every time, but nothing happened.Those buttons worked prior to this procedure, so i am worried that i might have damaged the DA pcb with soldering. Or maybe i should solder all other contacts and only then it will work...i am not so much in electronics...

Hello everyone. I was inspired by your modifications to make my own wmo-adder but i am facing few problems.
First i can't figure out pin layout on wmo 1.1, so i don't know which pin to connect to pins on DA pcb. I just couldn't figure out that by looking at pictures posted on this thread. I uploaded picture of both pcbs and i humbly ask for some idle soul to connect right pins using ms paint or similar program,so i could know where to solder wires.
Second i am not sure if my DA is rev 2 or rev 3. I think it is rev 3 but i would like someone to confirm this based on photo i am providing.
Third problem is that i solderd wire to 4th pin on DA and than tried all possible solutions on wmo pcb and clicked on left mouse and scroll mouse button every time, but nothing happened.Those buttons worked prior to this procedure, so i am worried that i might have damaged the DA pcb with soldering. Or maybe i should solder all other contacts and only then it will work...i am not so much in electronics...

http://s1260.photobucket.com/albums/ii574/upl...CN1195.jpg