if they made goldsrc work on high ping, they would sell game no prablam

u mean golden axe

A game, properly nurtured and presented, can appeal to any gamer. There is always a demand for a good game, regardless of genre or difficulty.

I agree.

the market is flooded with shit and next to no demand: each quake, warsaw, xonotic, nexuiz: all microscopic communities

more is to come: shootmania and the new pk. pk is more "worthy" of being a competitive title because of its depth, but won't capture a playerbase. Shootmania I guess has some potential to become the league of legends of shooters. everyone here will be furious(and irrelevent because this community is literally nothing) regardless of its success.

If someone were to want to make the next potential competitive shooter: you should be avoiding a place like esr. various vocal subgroups of minorities nitpicking about how everything is being ruined based off of gameplay not mirroring their nostalgic ideals. This place hasn't left 1999. praise or disapproval from this website is irrelevent as fuck anyways because it's microscopic in the grand scheme of things, all a gamedev would get out of coming here is depression.


make an innovative, fun to watch, fun to play game(regardless of whether you're good or terrible), and the game will attract a competitive scene with proper backing. Think about concepts like ultra's in sf4: they sound like casual garbage, and they kind of are. but it's different, adds a dynamic element to the game, AND it helps people that suck have a chance at winning, making it more fun for them too! everyone wins. these are the kind of designs that HAVE to be made for a successful game.

Please use another example than sf4, I've never seen a game so unable to decide if it was meant for casual players or hardcore fg players ( dem bugs dem never planned links dem features ).

As for the gamedev part, read the shootmania threads. The two times a year that kind of people hop around here they're spastically regurgitating words to flood their points on the way to internet truth and not having convos. You can't do shit with that kind of people.

"There is always a demand for a good game, regardless of genre or difficulty."

Yeah I think a lot of people get hooked on this idea that modern games are appealing because they are easy. I think we have precedent in StarCraft 2 and DoTA 2 that, if there are sufficient numbers for the correct features to correctly operate, we can create a linear correlation between skill and fun rendering difficulty a non-factor.

To give examples, the two most important things that help StarCraft 2 achieve this are: Match-Making and Single-Player.

Single-Player teaches the game to new players, letting them follow a storyline whilst simultaneously introducing them to more and more game mechanics so when they eventually reach multiplayer if that's what they wish to do, they are not too overwhelmed.

Their Match-Making system allows them to feel inferior enough to want to improve but never hopeless enough as to make the game unappealing.

DoTA 2 is a game where the learning curve is initially very steep because it is a knowledge based game. But through good match-making, social features like co-op bot matches and community driven content, they manage to successfully mitigate the difficulty curve and allow newer players to enjoy the game at all stages.


It seems to me that QuakeLive could have achieved great numbers, but it lacked good marketing and the game was never complete and is still not a complete experience. As 2GD rightly pointed out in one of the interviews he did, QuakeLive is not a modern game and it does not have modern functionality that is required to drive an esports game.

I guess my point with this post is that, I definitely believe the pandering and dumbing down of your game play decisions isn't necessary for a successful game. But equally you have a responsibility to make the experience fun at all levels and we need to follow the successful models that DoTA2 and StarCraft 2 have shown us. The hardcore players are very important, but they make up a very small percentage of the total users and game design has to cater to both parties and never sacrifice good game play to do so.

Once you have the numbers, you need to keep the numbers through good implementation and create an environment where those players can give back and grow the community through their actions. When you achieve that, you get a game like SC2 or DoTA2, a game that has prosperity and perpetual growth.