because proxies?

I mean ESReality..

yes well proxies work pretty much everywhere

If you ban them, they'll just come back under a proxy... Even to Esreality.

Well nobody has banned this guy, and he has been a member since 2011.

So lets try banning this tard?

I'm not against giving it a try. But the current strategy makes sense. Keep your friends close and your enemies even closer. Letting them their account means that you can keep them in probation and let them post with their name which is equivalent to a giant arrow pointed toward them with "I am a retard" written on it.

1.- ESR is bigger than quake and gaming.

2.- There aren't many banned cheaters posting anyway, I think. Can only name daddy (ql) and jamerio (cs). The rest exiled themselves after getting caught, for example zeroql (reads esr doesn't post).

3.- As for griefers, here practically no one is banned, unless very, very, very annoying users like raythenoob and cooloutac.

You forgot about Usagi.

you mean GOD OF WAR sanchez, Funny troll.

lithxiv?

Hmm, don't think he posts here often.

my mistake then

No problem, just don't make the same mistake in the future.

hehe mistakes hehe

it has nothing to do with proxies. it has nothing to do with esr being bigger than quake and gaming. it is because sujoy and demiurge appreciate what it is. esr is presented as a community, and it is. there is no dictator calling for order.

some users are given some power after demonstrating some reliability, so that they can censor other users. if these users demonstrate a capacity for undue censorship that the community finds to be unacceptable, those users lose their privileges.

that said, if you push for a person to be banned from the site and you can convince the users to agree with you, i'm sure it could be a possibility for that person to be banned. are you really motivated enough to give up your precious time to undertake the task of motivating hundreds of users--many very much unconcerned with such issues so long as the issues don't directly affect their enjoyment of the twisted social experience esreality offers--to express a desire to see your initial desire through?

is this going to be your moment to shine?

True words spoken from an anonymous proxy.

"esr is presented as a community, and it is. there is no dictator calling for order."

where is xou ?

people don't see cheaters as a problem yet

typing isn't a game

those quotation marks around my name, incorrect usage
also, rofl get a life ('participate', 'community')

According to the time date, you have "participated" in this "community" discussion in no less than TWO HOURS since the post went up.

... during a life lacking saturday night.

so true. ouch,gg.

I think the way it is now, posts need to be approved is the most sane solution, even with a ban he'll come back as anonymous or fake nick. This way at least we know it's him.

To answer shortly: because of freedom of speech and freedom of participation.

First of all, it's hard to establish decent rules and guidelines in regards to permanently banning somebody from any website that has community involvement, and should ideally only be done with clear cases (such as for example: repetitive rule abuse in a short period of time, posting of extreme or obscene content with malice, spambot activity), as the more intermediate stuff (such as the above-mentioned cheater and griefer) should involve a lot of analysis prior to banning, and as long as ESR keeps the same attitude in regards to freedom of people's voices and choices act, things hopefully stay the same.

Second of all, there are already certain systems in place to safeguard user account credibility: every newly registered user's (re-edit: DISREGARD THAT, the original was correct and then I had a brainfart and did a Jam-Jam edit with the removal of the apostrophe) ten posts have to be put in the approval/moderation queue to be approved or rejected by an admin (and the admin user panel is right above the streams by default, allowing easy access to the Approval/Moderation Queue (along with other cool shit). This either eliminates or mellows out new users via admin support or advice (we also advise and help the new users whose initial post is to promote a cup, tournament or community with formatting and such) who seem to be fixated on obscenity (a la "fucking X player, noob lost final of Face IT cup hahaha coward pussy I rape him and his mom in mouth haha devil brain"), and successfully gets every spambot that is targeting spam via posts rather than instant messages (which get dealt with at the same pace anyway since they get reported really fast via a journal or forum thread).

Third of all, (continuing about safeguarding practices from trolls/griefers/cheaters), there is a system in place to discuss users that are developing undesirable trends (such as for example raythenoob) or breaking rules (as well as spambots, anonymous users with certain IPs, etc) which is fairly effective, and the people who have managed to go full retard end up on probation, which means they are unable to send instant messages and every post they make goes in the approval/moderation queue along with the new users. You can see the list of users here and read the explanations of user levels here.

I guess this is where the variety comes from: every admin has their interpretation of approval/rejection/nuking of posts made by probationary users, which I would consider going along two schools of thought. Although both agree on the stuff clearly defined by logic (either rejection or nuking/deletion of posts breaking rules, which mostly deals with obscenity which most often comes down to pointless profanity or hardcore pornography... the censorship of content on ESReality would find it beneficial to follow the same guidelines for censorship of content of any general interest magazine that doesn't involve a brown paper bag and a shocked look by the grocer (which would mean borrowing the standards of decency from FHM or Maxim or even Playboy but definitely not from Fisting Octogenarians or Puking Bitches Quarterly)).

But the differences arise on the content that doesn't directly break any direct obscenity rules, and the first of those two schools of opinion* dictates that freedom of speech should apply to any post that is not in direct breach of obscenity should be approved, and that the decision to reject posts is not one of moral integrity. The second school of thought centers on the fact that the majority of probationary users have followed a certain negative trend in their posting history in order to be demoted into probation in the first place, and that certain continuation of said trends will not get their posts approved. If the subject then proceeds to question the reason their post is not showing up, you tell them the exact reason (above), after which they proceed to call you a faggot for deleting their post, and in zhu's case, proceed to quit the forum for the next time. I am, however, slightly biased for the workings of the second side so don't take my account as neutral (in my opinion, it works best for improving the content of esreality: either the probationary user starts improving their behavioral trends, they continue to post garbage which may get rejected or they get discouraged at inability to whore attention and leave. CooloutAC for example isn't banned, he is still on probation, he just isn't active here anymore.

Oh, and to top it off, I should add that it's considered bad manners to reverse the decision of another admin, as it shows lack of trust in their decision making and is considered an overkill reaction (a standard one would be to use the default channels of communication on the forums or IRC to start a debate ), and has only happened once ever as far as I know, when that dude currently known as "Herr" un-nuked some posts in the midst of what appeared to be a rage spree.

* Two schools of opinion, yet I consider there to be 5 stances within the admin team: one for each side, undecided, floating on a case-by-case basis and "I last logged in in 2005".

Fantastic read.

Oh, and to add regarding bans: they are not unheard of, but only in cases where communication with the person in question has been tried repetitively with no success, while the user continues to contribute posts of either a low intellectual or borderline retarded content at a high rate, while the feeling of the ESReality userbase is unanimous on that a ban is needed. There were two such cases in the past year or year and a half: the high profile one being raythenoob, and the one people will remember less being that Russian guy who communicated via google-translate prepared tractates which went something along the lines of "Why promode the bad? It konechno obvious lower rank intelligence player than vanilla q3, and I hate the CPM because PQL bad))".

Morning edit: oh and I somehow missed Sanchez aka GodOfWar aka Usagi aka shadowmaster255 who also was banned + his new aliases get found out pretty fast since his writing style is very distinctive. He actually still randomly attempts to post on ESR by the way, mostly as (hopefully proxied) Anonymous User (his last attempt was yesterday haha).

there is no sense in putting giefers on probation when they still are able to:
http://www.esreality.com/post/2410592/smaking-the-smakahontas/
(even without demo, i wonder how it could be approved.)
he also posted demos of cheating against k1llsen, rapha, cypher and an online tournament on esr.

i dont see any benefit for the gaming community from giving daddy_ the opportunity to annoy players with threads about his cheating activities against them.
furthermore the nolifer has about 200 accounts in qlranks with invalid game results.
therefore i would ban him on esr to delete his source of attention, this might make him stop creating cheat accounts aswell.
and dont even try to tell me, his posts are an intellectual enrichment for this site.

don't get me wrong, because i agree with certain aspects from above about not banning cheaters:
esr is bigger than a certain game where someone is banned at.
it makes it easier to know, who you are talking with.
and as long as someone who was banned at a game is making normal threads or posts, it is harmless and i dont see any reason for banning him on esr.
but as soon as someone repeatedly creates game accounts to cheat and post demos of it on a website for the gaming community to annoy players, it is ... basically terrorism.

so I TERRORIZE u! bAhahaAhaha

As far as Daddy is concerned, you are right, but you're also missing, probably because you're invested emotionally, a key to the entire issue - any and all attention he gets is the exact amount of attention he is granted by other users. If you're unable to move past his antics the fault does not lie with him, because he is who he is and he's unlikely to ever change his attitude, especially for someone he has a beef with, the problem is with you.

I'm glad ESR, being a separate entity to QL, does not extend punishments served there to here. Your personal conflicts are less important than upholding administrative integrity of this site.

"you're invested emotionally" - of course i am, why not? but this doesn't invalidate my arguments.

"a key to the entire issue - any and all attention he gets ... the problem is with you." - summarization of that section: he is an idiot and won't change. the problem is the attention he gets, so we are the problem. so instead of banning him, we should let him continue. by the way, anyone can see you lurking for drama in that forum.

"I'm glad ESR, being a separate entity to QL, does not extend punishments served there to here." - i already agreed on that, read the third section of my previous post again.

"Your personal conflicts are less important than upholding administrative integrity of this site." - to uphold the administrative integrity of this site, it should be prevented that daddy_ creates personal conflicts.

Your entire argument hinges on the fact that you find him disruptive. Which is fine and dandy, personal conflicts are a normal thing in community settings. Thing is though, he is not disruptive in general, not to the point where a permanent removal would be warranted. It takes a lot of effort to get banned from ESR, and only a couple of people took it that far. He's not one of those people, even if he is, objectively speaking, an idiot.

Herein lies the integrity issue, because if he was banned, it would break the line of staff - user conduct that is deeply ingrained into this website. It's not that he creates conflicts, lots of people here are involved in one or multiple petty conflicts with each other - it's that he didn't cross any lines doing it.

I understand that you find him annoying, and there are measures you can take to avoid interacting with him - ignore him figuratively, literally using the site function, or keep the circus going, turn the interaction into an entertainment instead of a nuisance.

"Your entire argument hinges on the fact that you find him disruptive." - my entire argument hinges on the fact that he is a griefer. how can i not find him disruptive?
you again desperately try to break it down to just my personal problem.

the rest of your post justifies a griefer's behaviour like this:
personal conflicts are normal.
griefers just create multiple personal conflicts.
that is normal, let them continue.
they arent crossing any lines while doing so.
it is up to the players that get annoyed to avoid interaction with griefers.
see it as an entertainment.

but what really shocked me to most was:
"Herein lies the integrity issue, because if he was banned, it would break the line of staff - user conduct that is deeply ingrained into this website." - while some of the aspects shadyak wrote down match daddy_'s behaviour, even with your beloved conduction line in place:
1.) "Third of all, (continuing about safeguarding practices from trolls/griefers/cheaters), there is a system in place to discuss users that are developing undesirable trends"
2.) "pointless profanity"
http://www.esreality.com/post/2288212/daddy-vs-evil/
3.) "after which they proceed to call you a faggot for deleting their post" - additionally daddy_ even omits it:
http://www.esreality.com/post/2410592/smaking...pid2410659
4.) "while the user continues to contribute posts of either a low intellectual or borderline retarded content at a high rate"
http://www.esreality.com/post/2152944/who-s-your-daddy05/

i understand that you like lurking arround in his threads for drama and therefore defend him with trying break it down to just my personal problem twice.
but the fact is he is a retarded nolife-griefer that repeatedly creates game accounts to blatantly cheat and then posts it on a website for gaming to further annoy players.
there is no arguing about the truth.

EDIT: just saw that shadyak plussed you and therefore i dont expect daddy_ to get banned anymore. this is why investing further time into this discussion is a waste of time for me.

just my personal problem.

Because that's all this is. You won't change the way this website works by stomping your feet, clenching your fists and getting annoyed. Develop some thicker skin, dude.

this is the third time you try to personalize it, therefore i just copy-paste from my previous post:
"but the fact is he is a retarded nolife-griefer that repeatedly creates game accounts to blatantly cheat and then posts it on a website for gaming to further annoy players."

hf with him.

I'm already having fun, watching him rage you to hell and back. It's blatantly obvious you have a personal problem - either get over it or don't, it ain't my problem and it ain't the problem of this site's staff. Simple as.

fourth time:
"but the fact is he is a retarded nolife-griefer that repeatedly creates game accounts to blatantly cheat and then posts it on a website for gaming to further annoy players."

Why can't you understand that being a "retarded nolife-griefer that repeatedly creates game accounts to blatantly cheat and then posts it on a website for gaming to further annoy players" is not something that will get you banned from ESR?

"EDIT: just saw that shadyak plussed you and therefore i dont expect daddy_ to get banned anymore."

ESR administration has never been particularly bright, mostly it's been non-existing but some time ago (maybe 3 years) there was a dark period of nanny administration, where namely Demiurge started censoring LMAO@POLAND-brand of "guy/nerd humour" posts as some kind of embedded necessary feat of adminning, when people merely wanted him to get rid of a viagra-spambot. It's better when the baboon is asleep than in control, trust me.

lol dat second guy you mentioned definitely posts some scary shit i'd rather read some usagi or jamerio stuff

Should be Fisting Octogenarians ;) You are a wizard Shady, but more like that cool philosophy professor who's also comfortable smoking weed with his students. 0:

Shady's school of life.

Bro do you even... Yeah, you do english ok.


Also: Good read.

lol

Because if you ban each and every emotionally and mentally regressed fucktard, then on whom will you take pity on, laugh at, hate or put it on ignore list?

u

Afraid of posting with your account? How sad.

u

That's a nice letter. Prefer ponies better tho.

/block

done

WORLD WAR III ABOUT TO GO DOWN ON THIS THREAD.

So you can put them on ignore instead of dealing with ton of fake accounts and anonymous posters.

we could give all of them a forced flag that stands for cheater

/hides

lol

WH? WH?

more like in these days...

yet there hasn't been a single Russian busted good player in QL..

some russian whos nick started with "z" was caught some time ago

i said quakelive

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP1uGHijmjA

and noone else

still one more than u perviously stated

This. Heroes like sombra and zeroql deserve their own user level : cheater.

I like Daddy_

I think he's a fascinating individual, and everytime I get to play him, I try to understand his motivations with sincere questions. For now I have gathered nothing, he is still quite the mistery.

I mean, after all these years, one would get bored doing this day after day ? What can it be ? Self esteem issues only resolved by the stomping of hard-working ql players ? The simple rush of hitting everything ? The fear of getting owned with no cheats on ?

Banning him would only result in me never knowing the truth

This all sounds like a convoluted Jeremy Kyle episode to me now.

from what I've gathered it's him simply being the worst loser I've ever seen, making sure he never loses again and making up for all the matches he has once lost!

I agree.

Also is there a point when trolls become terrorists?

It seems like while the activities vary greatly in severity, their underlying motivations are similar.

who cares as long as they dont participate in cups, etc :-)

who cares as long as they dont participate in anything, ever, again*

*fixed

i think you are referring to this:
http://www.esreality.com/post/2251589/daddy-v...er-strenx/

you think wrong

ups my fault. i meant melted's "cups" instead of your "anything".