it's the execution, aim and dodging

vo0 isn't +forward
he played standard ql style when i used to watch him on his stream.
the biggest differences between the two: evil has a lot more confidence, awareness, and a much better shaft.
"evil knows things" - ddk

the +back style isnt favored ,never has been. The style is for people with weak aim and a small penis.

i have weak aim and small penis and still I am all +forward...

Even more respect ! ;)

We are talking about successful players mate. :(












































<3

awwww snapple

i like ur style guard, havnt seen u duelling in a while.
play more!

it's punishment for living with wife/gf...

Must be hard having both of them living with you

http://cdn.niketalk.com/b/b7/b77df384_2dmdrp5.gif

That's weird because gl00my said it felt like 20 cm.

and he would know

Nicely put but better pick up some more rockets and grenades to spam.

he's not stupid +forward style, evil is in fact the one who plays purely for items like dahang or cooller but unlike them instead of keeping cycling items no matter what happens on the map he goes to kill opponent when he has a solid stack/weapon advantage or some temporary positional advantage when the enemy is caught in some place for example. Other top players like rapha or cypher always play 'their opponent' rather than for the items and always maintain position to keep safe rather than try to get the maximum items amount. Overall his style ain't really that super +forward like some other players, he might only go +forward when he's losing or just to get some spawnfrags, no idea why people call him one of the most agressive players, maybe comparing to other top4 players but not really that agressive overall.
What helps him to succeed versus everyone is good fighting ability to deal damage from ANY position so basically positional play is useless vs him. no matter where both players stand he will always deal sick amount of damage. I think I wouldn't shoot/spam him at all if there's a possibility of taking damage myself, basically the reason why cypher gets destroyed with his constant tries to deal some damage. And also in fact he has a nice 'dodging while pushing' ability dodging most defensive spam hence being so hard to counter with his lg agression.
Also when people say that Cypher, Cooller or whoever else has the best rocket, it's laughable cause evil was always known to have the best rocket among russian duel players. He just tends to use lg in more situations so people are calling him lg only, eventhough his lg is not really that good if we talk about raw aim tracking, he gets destroyed by strenx and other good aimers in equal 1v1 fights. Whereas if you look at rocket fights he NEVER loses them and in some cases his rockets just win him the game(take the epic ending versus chance for example)

have a plus wise russian cyka :D

feels like all of the quake community has a bit of russian inside them, and know atleast a few words of the motherlands tongue.

i recently started to learn russian, by myself.

i know the signs,now im looking for some books to get vocabulary

yeah ive been sorta conspiring to learn some russian aswell.

evil was always known to have the best rocket among russian duel players.

I disagree. Here's him missing 7 out of 8 rockets against rapha:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsdLyPfEsn4&t=9m18s

Also, his raw aim tracking during QCon was pretty much amazing. And so was his railgun aim. Overall, I feel like his hitscan is at least as good as his rockets.

i don't agree pinning evil's rocket skills down on one particular example, like you do here, but it's funny because in the video zoot is like "here's evil with some great rockets" ... lol

I disagree. Here's him hitting 4 face rockets in a row :
*pull random clip*

Every player will have situations where he did good and where he did bad. An example like yours cannot prove anything.

Of course, my conclusion is based on more observations. I think there were plenty situations during QCon where evil's LG and RG won him a match. And I think this is a great example of how his rockets (and weapon choice!) let him down during a very important fight.

Most other players would have lost that fight and retreated... He did a very good job, RL vs LG next to pillars is extremely hard.

... for the LG player.

He DID lose the fight. He almost lost the match because of this situation. If his rockets had been decent or if he had stuck with LG, he would have won the fight. Even retreating would have been better than missing 7 out of 8 rockets.

Are you serious? That was actually some really nice rocketing. Column rockets and countering that kind of good dodging is really hard, and he actually was very close a lot of the times!

You gotta be kidding me. He missed 7 out of 8 rockets. He had ~100 hp stack advantage and lost the fight. How could this possibly be "really nice rocketing"?

Excuse me, I think you gotta be kidding me. He didn't miss any of them in terms of splash damage, and they passed by but were close. Are you expecting direct rockets when the enemy can just move behind a pillar? You can't do more in such a situation.

He didn't miss any of them in terms of splash damage

You cleary have to watch it again. Most of the rockets did not do any splash damage. There's one decent rocket (~50dmg), all the others were complete misses. I'll admit, though, that the very last one (which lands on the wall behind rapha after evil's death) is hard to tell without sound.

Are you expecting direct rockets when the enemy can just move behind a pillar? You can't do more in such a situation.

I'll say it one more time: He had the stack advantage. He could have stuck with LG. He could have retreated and gone for the MH. Instead, he wanted to finish off rapha with RL and failed. If you have seen the match, you know that this was a turning point during the map which almost secured rapha the win.

As a side note, I feel like this was an exceptionally great move by rapha which surprised evil to such an extent that he made this wrong weapon choice and stuck with it until his death.

Prior to this encounter, evil appeared to be really comfortable on the map. Just like against DaHang, he could enforce fights the way he wanted to and always dealt more damage than he received.

In this situation, rapha throws grenades and thereby tempts evil to fire a rail shot. Rapha takes perfect advantage of the reload time by pushing in and taking the RA (which he had timed to the half-second, apparently) while evil can't bully him off. Not only did rapha reduce the stack disadvantage from ~200 to ~100 by doing this, he also visibly surprised evil who lost his cool and commited a crucial mistake.

i agree with alot of the stuff you say. his rockets are very good maybe better than his lg. but his lg then is not one of the best... it's more like really really relentless

I'd say his rocket is inconsistent, and can be truly appalling at times. Same goes for Baksteen.

You find Baksteen truly appalling at times?

His rocket play, yes.

instantly agreed about his rox because to this day I remember this frag

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_d...o&t=83

miss that q3 smoothness, wow.

cause evil was always known to have the best rocket among russian duel players.

I'm pretty sure that was PELE and then LeXeR :)

A) It's true he has some of the best rockets around but he lost some rockets fights in this QCon, while i doubt he lost a sigle LG fight on stream, and if you consider he takes more LG fights by a large number...

B) straight LG fights don't mean that much compared to the ability of hitting everything in other various situations. Every time you are running somewhere and he spots you he hits every single cell.
And who are these guys outlging him in duels? I don't see many.

PS: if he plays purely for the items but takes every chance to pressure his opponent he doesn't play purely for the items :D

His rockets were good that moment, in fact i'd say he shot where he wanted too, it's just rapha had good dodging at that moment. This is how i like to look at rocket fights. You can shoot rockets exactly where you want 100% of the time but you cannot always predict a players dodging pattern so even if you shot where you wanted there will always be moments where you will miss. Each of evils rocket's that moment were very reasonable prediction of where rapha could have dodged to, but he didn't. One could blame it on bad prediction by evil or just the unchangable factor that you will always miss a rocket in some situations.

http://www.esreality.com/post/2446706/#pid2446646

he's not pure +forward though, he's more aggressive when there's an opportunity where most players would play it safe. jumping over rockets and hammering some close range lg has more to do with his ability than a legimate tactic with quake as it is. he's the luis hamilton of quake. makes rapha's adaptability depending on the player quite impressive.

I think he often plays those mind games where he double backs in a situation where opponents don't expect him too.
Like he appears to be moving away from a fight but returns immediately as soon as the opponent neglects his positioning.
A big part of that is also his ability to know really well how much damage he can deal out in what time and what his opponent's stack is.
At least that is something I noticed often during QuakeCon games. I think it is also what dahang (iirc) meant when he said evil does things that would not work for anyone else in the game. It feels like he relies on moves that are sometimes so obvious that they are almost unexpected again.. :)

It's easy to play +forward all time, when you deal twice damage your oponent just, because.

people will flame at me for telling the truth :(

That should give you enough hints as to how that style evolved... why it works is just confidence and ability.

netcode is fine

Yes it's the "confidence" that strikes me when I see him playing. But another strength are his steel nerves which makes his execution flawless with almost any opponent.
Only at QuakeCon this year seemed like Rapha breaked him on the last map Toxicity which was his weaker map vs good american players like Zero4 and Chance.

"breaked him" -> "broke him"

Stupid english rule but just thought I would let you know.

oh

"why it works is just confidence and ability"

A statement of most successful endeavours?!

I don't say he's bad... he's really really good at this style.

What I see a lot with baksteen and evil is that they have those amazing intermittent LG pushes just for 1 second to really harass the opponent (it's very different compared to a rail here and there) and either check how they react to that immediately and on the next item.

What do these pushes require: perfect timing (not item timing, but prediction timing, when is the opponent rushing from one hole to the next etc) and a very consistent accuracy during these pushes.

Baksteen+good lg? :)

I think baksteen is a tad more creative than evil.

To have the fighting skill of evil and his dmg output capability > "tad more creative"

Evil is a refined strenx with less competition around, I think if strenx took quake seriously again he would be about where Evil is. k1llsen,strenx,evil are the few duelers who can win a duel when being out smarted just because they have such amazing combat skills. The problem is on lan players like cypher and rapha combat skills are enhanced to be close to if not on the same level of those 3.

I don't see much +back in QL, avoiding a fight where you are out stacked isn't +backing, in q3 people ran from fights when fully stacked that is +back. A few players like evil and so on are more prone to take a fight where they have slight less stack because QL favors this with 80 damage rails, in q3a evil would get railed once and lose every fight with his current style which is why he played q3a nothing like he plays QL.

strenx took ql far more serious than evil, and all he got is 2nd place @ qcon.

dont ever compare strenx and evil

so did evil :P, in a time when there's a lot less competition than before (2013 against 2010). Evil also got second place on the last lan he attended before qcon, losing to cooller.

Overall strenx has more achievements and consistency than evil, just not first place at a major lan.

If strenx comes back then he would have a nice shot at the title, since he actually likes playing against evil (strenx wins when defending with lg).

lol actually this may be true because he is and will be the only human being who came back stronger in raw skills after switching to shootmania.

yeah but doesnt matter the competition. u still have to go through rapha. and evil won dhw

it'd require a bit of luck, like evil defeating rapha in semis then strenx wins the finals.

I'm always genuinely impressed at the selective memory of some people when it comes to how good strenx was. If a 2nd place at quakecon isn't impressive when in addition to this year's edition's best players other than evil (rapha, dahang and zero4, who were all also in attendance in 2011) we had Cypher (knocked out by strenx), Cooller (knocked out by strenx), av3k, Spart1e, czm, noctis (knocked out by strenx) and tox, surely evil's second place this year when none of these players were present is way less impressive.

I'm always genuinely impressed at stupidity of some.

strenx didnt win a lan. evil did. bye bye

And?

read whole conversation and you will know, dumbass

Warrant made a quick comparison between strenx and evil, then you showed up looking like an idiot. Not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.

god, youre some kind of genetic engineered beltard?

I'm always genuinely impressed at the selective memory of some people when it comes to how good strenx was

usually ppl take achievements into consideration when you want to measure player skill... so yeah, strenx didnt won a lan, and its important.

Evil is a refined strenx

dont ever compare strenx and evil

comparing strenx and evil is like comparing killsen to agent... both play ql, nothing more.

We're not comparing careers. How many 1st place titles are there between rapha and evil? Does that mean that the qcon final was a stomp in favor of rapha?

To argue that strenx and evil can't be compared because evil won one event and strenx zero is completely moronic. strenx could perfectly hang with the likes of av3k, Cooller, rapha, Cypher and k1llsen, and proved so repeatedly. Just stop, you're embarrassing yourself.

why do you stupid mofos jump to stupid conclusions all the time?

we're comparing skills. one of objective ways to measure skill is to check achievements. evil has 4 apperances on international lan. even if he did win all 4 he would be far behind rapha.

To argue that strenx and evil can't be compared because evil won one event and strenx zero is completely moronic.

i didnt say it, l2brain beltard.

He would be far behind rapha in terms of career. He wouldn't necessarily be far behind rapha in terms of skill - in fact, in your hypothetical scenario, he would now possibly be ahead of rapha in terms of skill, despite having less overall achievements. What do you not understand about this?

So far, your entire argument as to why we can't "ever compare" strenx to evil is that evil has won one event and strenx hasn't. If you have any other moronic reasons you want to bring up, I'm all ears.

So far, your entire argument as to why we can't "ever compare" strenx to evil is that evil has won one event and strenx hasn't.

no it isnt my argument. i never said it. you made it to not look stupid. we cant compare evil and strenx because they have comnpletly different gameplay. eventho both have lots of lg time, even the way their use it is different.

fact, in your hypothetical scenario, he would now possibly be ahead of rapha in terms of skill, despite having less overall achievements. What do you not understand about this?

time to use the organ you obviously lack. evil provides way too small sample to judge his skills, and yet hes got better results than strenx already.

evil has been on the scene for well over 10 years... i think thats enough time to judge his skills.

yeah, 10 years if we ignore his break.

his ql account is 4 years old

Your posts until your last one had only contained two things: "don't ever compare them" and "strenx never won a lan". You made the link between the two, and you admitted yourself that looking at achievements is important to measure skill - so yes, it is one of your arguments, and it was your only argument until you mentioned their gameplays. Stop pussying out of your own argumentation.

We have had plenty of matches to examine evil's skills. Does this mean that he can't still get even better? Obviously not. Does it mean we can still make comparisons based on the style and skill he's shown so far? Yes.

Your posts until your last one had only contained two things: "don't ever compare them" and "strenx never won a lan". You made the link between the two

nope, you did. i dont pussy out, you're just dumb and have serious comprehension problem.

evil is surely top player, but as he attended only 4 lans, we can say if he's really top dog, or just some wanna be like strenx

he has attended more lans than strenx, foshoe

by lan i meant international lan, not one of many russian lans.

Here's you making the link: "we're comparing skills. one of objective ways to measure skill is to check achievements."

I'm not discussing what the future holds for evil. I'm pointing out that there is nothing intrinsically invalid about a comparison between him and strenx (nobody is saying they have the same playstyle either).

god, please, die or ill get eye cancer from reading bullshit you're typing here.

To argue that strenx and evil can't be compared because evil won one event and strenx zero is completely moronic.

you did make this link.

i just said we cant compare evil and strenx, and evil won a lan. rest is yours false assumptions.


and yeah, if you like to compare shoes with cars, then yeah, we can compare strenx and evil.

Did you somehow miss the part of my post where I pointed out to you where you made the link? Here's a hint: it's the first sentence.

I like to compare players which are at a similar level and have some similar features to their game - in that regards, we can compare strenx and evil.

i made shit, its your bad and stupid interpretation.

Yes, the sentence where you argue that looking at achievements helps to assess skill (a statement I don't even disagree with) definitely does not link skill and achievements.

so in the end, you agree strenx is nowhere near evil in terms of skill and achievements?

No, I don't. Where did you get that from?

if u dont disagree then you agree.


also, just noticed, you mixed whole argument into one giant bullcrap. yes - skill and achievements are linked.

the fact strenx and evil cant be compared as players because evil has lan win isnt.


so maybe su cause apparently your lack of intelect is contagious

I agree with the proposition that looking at achievements helps to assess skill (notably because a LAN environment is different from an online environment, and performing well on LAN with more money on the line requires additional skills, for example in terms of ability to play well under pressure). I don't agree with the proposition that strenx' lan anchievements are "nowhere near" evil's. It seems to me that you should really work on those comprehension skills of yours.

I don't really have anything to add here - scroll up and read your first posts again if you can't see how you linked the two.

yeah ignore my whole post, just because you dont have anything smart to say

Which part did I ignore, the part when you tried to attribute a position to me with your idiotic "if u dont disagree then you agree", showing your comprehension skills suck, or the part where you repeated for the nth time that you didn't link the two, in response to which I advised you to read your first posts again?

you srsly think i wouldnt notice how you changed the topic?

at first you were like:

So far, your entire argument as to why we can't "ever compare" strenx to evil is that evil has won one event and strenx hasn't.

which is bullshit, made up by you, i never said it. and you linked two parts of my post. which was stupid.



apparently, later you noticed how stupid you are, and changed the defense to

Yes, the sentence where you argue that looking at achievements helps to assess skill (a statement I don't even disagree with) definitely does not link skill and achievements.

and yeah, this one is true. achievements are linked to skills, thats what i said.


clever idea, but wont work.

Linking skills to achievements is what led you to discard a comparison between strenx and evil based on evil's lan victory. That's why you replied to my post which was about skill by saying that evil had won a lan and strenx not, and that's why you replied to Warrant's post which was about skill by saying that evil had won a lan and strenx not.

Linking skills to achievements is what led you to discard a comparison between strenx and evil based on evil's lan victory

proof or didnt happen

That's why you replied to my post which was about skill by saying that evil had won a lan and strenx not, and that's why you replied to Warrant's post which was about skill by saying that evil had won a lan and strenx not.

you already shown amazing comprehensions skills, maybe stop for now?

See the two posts I just mentioned. Are you somehow unable to scroll up?

proof/quote or didnt happen

I guess you are.

hahahha i think i never meet more brain damaged person.

i didnt say we cant compare strenx and evil because of lan win in post you just mentioned.


back to start: finish kinder garten before you start posting

is this guy for real or what

Does your perception of the skill difference between strenx and evil factor in your assertion that they can't be compared? Apparently yes.
Does the fact that evil won a lan and strenx not factor in your assertion that there is a skill difference between evil and strenx? Apparently yes (you even wrote it was "important").
Therefore, according to your own posts, the fact that evil won a lan and strenx not was clearly one of the factors which led you to reject a comparison between the two. And it was the only reason you mentioned until comment #72 in which you evoked their respective gameplays. QED.

more wrong assumptions.

Does your perception of the skill difference between strenx and evil factor in your assertion that they can't be compared?

no, and i said it clearly

Does the fact that evil won a lan and strenx not factor in your assertion that there is a skill difference between evil and strenx? Apparently yes (you even wrote it was "important").

nope, also said it.

And it was the only reason you mentioned until comment #72

you prefered your totally false presumptions, instead of asking my opinion.

Woah, denial levels over 9000. You're apparently back to claiming that the lan achievement of evil did not factor in your evaluation of the skill between the two, even though that's what you directly said previously. Nice.

god you're dumb.

and obviously cant read. if i said: "good thing hitler died" you would prolly claim i said hitler was good.

No, you would probably claim you said hitler was good, given the comprehension levels you've displayed thus far.

sorry, but i just said it was good thing hitler died.

you dont understand english at all, trying to cover your lacks with some made up stories

That's my point - good job showing your lack of basic comprehension skills again. You'd start by saying it was a good thing hitler died, then five posts later you'd say the opposite and claim you never said that.

your point has no background


and this whole conversations is fine example how you imagine things, and say they are true.

The background is this conversation, and the posts I linked to.

posts which prove your're delusional

So, when you say that there is a skill difference between evil and strenx, the fact that evil has won a major lan and strenx hasn't doesn't factor in your evaluation?

hasnt doesnt

Why did you declare, then, "usually ppl take achievements into consideration when you want to measure player skill... so yeah, strenx didnt won a lan, and its important"?

cause its important.

Surely you realize that your two assertions
(1) it is "important" to take into account that strenx hasn't won a lan to measure his skill
(2) that strenx hasn't won a lan doesn't factor in your measurement of his skills (compared to evil)
are contradictory?

yes, but second one is result of your imagination

I asked you if it didn't factor in your evaluation, and you replied that it didn't, thus contradicting assertion (1). Do you have short-term memory loss in addition to insanely low comprehension skills?

i was making fun of hasnt doesnt

How about answering the original question, then?

What do you hope to gain from this?

Not much, just the basic satisfaction that comes with confronting an idiot with his idiocy.

Carry on then.

i never said anything about skill of evil and strenx.

Why did you write "we're comparing skills", then?
Why declare that looking at achievements was important to measure player skill, if you weren't discussing skill?

ye badly said by me in #167


i never said shit about strenx skill compared to evil

You still said "we're comparing skills".

You also compared the achievements of evil and strenx and justified it by saying that achievements were relevant when it comes to evaluating skill.

Give up, you can't escape your own posts.

cause we werent comparing careers. dont try to justify your lack of logic by quoting things out of context.


nope i didnt. i just said evil has lan win, and achievements are good to measure skills. ow, and strenx has none.


try again

Yes, we weren't comparing careers, we were comparing skills, which you just denied doing.

You compared evil and strenx' achievements, and justified talking about achievements because they were relevant to assess skills. Which part of this is supposed to be wrong?

just as you tried to backup your argument of strenx being mega awesome with his ability to play and win against the best, i used achievements to show he isnt as super mega as you think.

i never meant to compare their skills, and i didnt. i compared achievements. find me a post where i say evil is better than strenx because he won lan.

You wrote "we're comparing skills", and you said yourself that you were looking at achievements because it was "one of objective ways to measure skill". I know you wish you hadn't written that, but you did. Deal with it.

i only wish for you to die, so you wont pass your faulty genes forward :-)

i said we're comparing skills, because you said some bullcrap about careers. and do you know what other use looking on achievements has? looking on achievements!!! i didnt use it to judge skills, otherwise you could easly post a quote were i say: "evil has lan win, he's better player than strenx"... but you cant.

basiclly, we're back again to the point where i said something, you cut if out of context, and make some false assumptions about it, because you're dumb.

You are the one desperately trying to change the context of your original quotes. I responded to your achievements claims saying that we were not trying to compare careers, and you replied by saying that we were comparing skills and that looking at achievements is a way to evaluate skills. Sorry, you can't escape your own words.

more like you cant escape your habit of making stupid assumptions.

you were like:

Not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.

and i was like:

usually ppl take achievements into consideration when you want to measure player skill... so yeah, strenx didnt won a lan, and its important.

and you was like:

We're not comparing careers.

obviously achievements can be used to judge player skill, but i never said evil is better because he won a lan, unlike strenx. thats your, one of many, delusions.

and, as we can see - you started this whole comparison bullcrap.

You realize that in the quote of yourself you just mentioned, you explain why achievements were being mentioned (by you), and that is "to measure player skill", right?
Since, in addition, you conveniently stopped quoting posts just before the post I'm talking about, let me remind you again of what you wrote in it:

we're comparing skills. one of objective ways to measure skill is to check achievements.

That's you directly admitting to comparing skills through looking at achievements. Face it, you lost the argument - just move on.

completly ignoring what i just said. how unexpected

I'm not ignoring it at all. I just pointed out to you how the very post you quoted showed why you were comparing achievements, and that you conveniently left out the next post which proves my point even more.

ok, you're not ignoring. just too stupid to understand it

You posted a quote in which you admitted yourself to be using achievements to measure skill. How dumb can you get? Your own words show you were comparing skills:

1. You stated it directly: "we're comparing skills".
2. You explained why you were comparing achievements by saying that looking at achievements was an objective way to evaluate skill.

You dug your own hole, and you can't escape it. Too bad.

unlike you, i stick to the topic. you started to throw some skill comparing bullcrap, so i had to reply in similar manner. and i quoted this in #179.

but, as it doesnt fit your delusional world, you ignored whole post, just like you ignored many other in past of this conversation. you only read whats convenient for you, and make up the rest.


im sure you will reply with "nono, you compared achievements, im so awesome" like you constantly do in this conversation.

You "had to reply in similar manner"? All you did in response to my post was paraphrase your original sentence, in the form of "strenx didnt win a lan. evil did. bye bye". In your following posts, you then proceeded to claim I did not understand your posts, and actually tried to clarify them by explaining what you meant - and like I demonstrated and your words clearly showed, it is in this attempt to clarify your argumentation that you admitted and explained you were 1. comparing skills 2. looking at achievements to compare skills. I understand you're unhappy with being trapped by your own words - tough.

I didn't ignore your post at all - to repeat myself AGAIN, I told you how the very quote you included in that post proves my point.

yeah, and from simple "strenx didnt win a lan" you made up some bullcrap about comparing skills, to which i had reply. and now you over interprate my own posts aswell. you did for whole conversation.


you're like beltard version of jamerio, but far worse. he understands english, and doesnt make any assumptions.

I don't need to "interprate" anything. You explained your own posts by saying "we're comparing skills". You explained your own posts by saying that you were looking at achievements because it is an objective way to evaluate skills. And now you are desperately trying to back away from your own words, and it's not working.

its not working cause you dont understand english at all.

it was YOU who made stupid assumption i did compare strenx and evil skillwise based on winnings, which i didnt, and i kinda had to carry on from that point.

and i spend last 2 days trying to explain this to you, but its like talking to a wall.

I don't need to make any assumption. You cleared all doubts when you wrote "we're comparing skills" and explained that you were looking at achievements because they were an objective way to evaluate skill. Stop trying to dodge your own words.

strenx took ql far more serious than evil, and all he got is 2nd place @ qcon.

dont ever compare strenx and evil

and your anwser:

Not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.

ring a bell? stop trying to dodge your own words.

Why would I dodge my own words?

cause they mean your delusional dumbass.

I haven't changed my stance one bit. You, meanwhile, are now denying what you wrote earlier. Your problem, not mine.

if you havent changed your stance, you do agree you're delusional and like to make fake assumptions, of which example i gave?

Why would I agree to that, considering I've quoted you as saying something you're now denying, namely that you were comparing skills?

why? i was sure you didnt change your stance, and you dont try to dodge your own words. which means you're delusional, as i proved.

and your only "comparing skills" card is one of your delusions.

Where I am being delusional? I'm still saying what I've been saying from the beginning, and I've provided you with clear evidence of why I'm right. If it's a delusion, why are you not addressing it? You're the one who wrote "we're comparing skills" and that looking at achievements was a way to evaluate skill, and who's now claiming he was never interested in comparing skills. It seems pretty clear you shouldn't be calling other people delusional.

i see you're trying hard to use "comparing skills" again.

but i'd say we discussed it enough, lets talk about content i mentioned in #192, which are your delusions in form of false assumptions.

How did we discuss it "enough"? It's the entire reason you can't lie your way out of what you said previously - it's written down. You desperately tried to obfuscate the line of posts and failed. Why did you write "we're comparing skills", and why did you explain that you were looking at (and comparing) achievements to evaluate skill, if you weren't comparing skills?

hahahaha, you're really desperate.


as i said: you started this whole comparing skills bullcrap, because of your false assumptions. which you now deny.

I didn't "start" anything. I replied to your posts, you replied in turn by saying I hadn't understood you, and you proceeded to explain your own posts and your position/logic by saying "we're comparing skills" and that looking at achievements (which you were comparing) was useful to evaluate skills.

You made those two statements to explain your own position. Way to shoot yourself in the foot.

Not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.

proven false assumption. and you just ignore it all the time. who shoot his own feet again?


instead of posting here in order to protect your imaginary world, go visit a doctor. with proper meds your mind wont fall apart.

You realize I just directly showed you why it wasn't a "false assumption", right? Why do you keep trying to claim this while ignoring the evidence I provided you with to show I was right? Unless it's because you know your own words prove you wrong...!

Come on, do explain how "we're comparing skills" and explaining that you were comparing achievements because it's a good way to measure skill fits with your claim that you were never comparing skills.

u didnt prove anything, as i explained my point of view in #137. which lead you to try and attack me based on cut out of context parts of my comments. there are actually more of your false assumptions in this thread:

Does your perception of the skill difference between strenx and evil factor in your assertion that they can't be compared? Apparently yes.

Does the fact that evil won a lan and strenx not factor in your assertion that there is a skill difference between evil and strenx? Apparently yes (you even wrote it was "important").

the purpose of comparison is to show better/worse option. so if i did compare them, there would be some kind of summary, where i say one is better. you already failed to find such post.


carry on with your "we're comparing skills" bullcrap, as thats all you got on me. and its just your delusion, cause you dont make any sense.

Your post #137 contains denials of what you stated previously. Perhaps you should have started by not saying what you said earlier.

The summary you refer to is in the content of your first posts, namely you discarding strenx with regards to evil.

Funny you're still dodging a direct quote from yourself. You managed to defeat yourself alone, congratulations.

more like you manage to keep providing proofs of your incompetence and delusions.

post #137 was perfect example that you fill unknown data with assumptions, which are stupid.

your trumph card is cut out of context. you started talking about skill, you compared evil to strenx first, in your initial post. idd i said "we're comparing skills" cause you did it first. sadly you fail to spot i never actually compared their skills. i even said evil skill cant be measured by achievements.

evil is surely top player, but as he attended only 4 lans, we can say if he's really top dog, or just some wanna be like strenx

#false.assumptions@quakenet.com

I understand that "false assumption" is to you what "projection" is to Jamerio, but at least try to read my posts before copy/pasting the same accusations I've already debunked. Again, post #137 is you denying what you wrote previously. If you disagree with this assessment, focus on responding to the evidence I gave of what you said previously instead of going back endlessly to that post.

You already claimed it was "out of context", and I already showed you why it wasn't. You didn't say "we're comparing skills" because I "did it first" (and what kind of reason is that?), you said it because you were responding to my "we're not comparing careers". When you wrote "we're comparing skills", you were therefore clarifying your own position, by explaining to me that you were indeed not comparing careers, but comparing skills instead. You were explaining to me that you were looking at achievements not because you were interested in comparing careers but because they were a good way to evaluate skill. That statement is therefore you being as clear as possible with regards to your position and what you were doing, namely comparing skills.

With regards to the last quote, I love how you're actually the one who is desperately resorting to taking quotes out of context. You wrote this in the context of an exchange over the idea of comparing rapha to evil based on achievements, and your response was that the sample was too low to get a definitive idea of where evil stood in terms of skills with regards to a top dog like rapha, but that he had already done more than strenx. This small sample therefore did not in any way make you renounce the comparison between strenx and evil that I've been pointing out, as also evidenced by your later posts in which you still explained you were comparing skills.

debunked? you just pasetd "we're comparing skills" quote. its your only anwser to everything i say.

if i did compare skills, give me the proof i actually did this. not "we're comparing skills" quote. show me the result of comparison i made. or maybe i didnt make any, and its just one of your many delusions?

I just provided you with an example of me debunking one of your claims, in the form of me explaining to you what the actual context of the quote was. I can't help but notice you've chosen not to respond to my explanation, and you'll probably go back to your debunked "it was taken out-of-context" argument in a few posts. Face it, you have no way of dodging that you admitted to comparing skills.

I already answered your question the first time you asked it. How about paying attention to what I write? Here's your answer: "The summary you refer to is in the content of your first posts, namely you discarding strenx with regards to evil". That's the result of your evaluation - evil can't be compared to strenx.

lol, more of your false assumptions.

show me where i did say evil is better than strenx. if i did compare their skills, there should be such post. dont hide behind bullcrap, just fucking quote me. otherwise, fuck off, as im getting tired of conversation with a fucking wall.

In case "lol, more of your false assumptions" is supposed to be a response to my comments debunking your pathetic "it was taken out-of-context" defence, allow me to point out that it sounds more like a surrender to me. I guess you've accepted you have no way of denying the fact that you admitted to comparing skills, and are now choosing to completely ignore the quote :-)

Why would there need to be such a post? Your evaluation of the players in terms of skill through achievements was not a goal in itself but a means justifying your claim to the invalidity of a comparison between strenx and evil. This claim can be found in your first post, as I've repeatedly told you.

stop hidding and fucking quote the part i asked for.

i will even make it easier for you: quote the actuall comparison part.

I have systematically replied to and shut down all of your rebuttals - nobody's hiding except the dumbass who can't find an answer to his own words without evoking an "it was taken out-of-context" defence I've just demonstrated is unfounded. Sorry, you can keep ignoring your own quotes all you want, they're not going to go away.

What do you mean by "actuall comparison part"? Did you not understand what I just wrote to you, including in reference to your first post? Read those lines as many times as you need, until you understand them.

quote or gtfo

Ah, I see what this is. You recognize that I've been running circles around you this entire discussion, and that you're completely unable to provide a rebuttal to my debunking of your erroneous out-of-context claim, so you're now looking for a way out that allows you to somehow save appearances.

The way out you think you've found consists in ignoring once and for all of your own quotes that prove you wrong, abandoning your failed defence of your debunked "out-of-context" claim, and focusing exclusively on changing the subject to the non-existence of a sentence containing the words "evil is more skilled than strenx". Unfortunately for you, I already told you why you explained you were comparing and evaluating their skills through achievements - it was to justify your claim to the invalidity of a comparison between strenx and evil, not an end in itself to make a distinctive statement like the one you're referring to. Since this seems to be flying over your head, I'll oblige you with a quote from your original post, that I already linked to and which contains the statement your skill comparison is justifying:

strenx took ql far more serious than evil, and all he got is 2nd place @ qcon.

dont ever compare strenx and evil

Come on, little scrub, keep refusing to argue the evidence and my rebuttal to your "out-of-context" claim and focus exclusively on the way out you think you've found - you know you're desperately trying to save face at this point.

so in his whole career strenx got one 2nd place?


assumptions + full of bullshit

Thanks for proving me right in dodging what I said you would :-)

The answer to your irrelevant question is no.

irrelevant? maybe in your world

if i was comparing them, it would go in favour of strenx, as hes got much more lans played, thus more top3 spots. however i never did compare them, so yeah, you're a delusional moron.

here goes your whole argument. again.

You did compare them. Here's you comparing their achievements in terms of 1st places: "strenx didnt win a lan. evil did".

Still dodging what I mentioned earlier. Keep trying.

so, when we compare achievements, in order to measure the skill, we take only first places? im quite sure i didnt say it.

so nope, try harder. making more things up will prolly help on a short distance.

I don't know, ask yourself, since you were the one doing it.

I made up your "we're comparing skills" quote? Did I somehow have access to your account?

no you didnt make up the quote, you made up the whole story behind it, and now, as i totally assraped your made up argument, you feel kinda lost. maybe tomorrow you will be more creative with inventing even more bullcrap stories.

I'm not sure in what universe you're supposed to have "assraped" any argument I've made, considering you never replied to my explanation as to why your "it was out-of-context!" claim was completely bogus. I'm still waiting!

ow, no witty response to my arguments? out of bullets already? thats really sad :<

i already explained. feel free to spam my inbox with more bullshit excuses

Which argument of yours am I supposed not to have replied to?

You didn't explain anything. You claimed it was taken out of context, I explained to you why it wasn't (see comment #211), and you stopped addressing the issue.

edit: as expected, hitsu goes for the exit after failing to escape his own contradictions :)

so, when we compare achievements, in order to measure the skill, we take only first places? im quite sure i didnt say it.

no response at all, but im not suprised.

i did explain everything, you just stupid and delusional.

I replied to that, in case you didn't notice. You were the one making the comparison. You declared it was "important" that evil got a first place and strenx didn't. So you're clearly the one that should be answering that question, not me :)

I'm curious, where did you respond to my demonstration of how your quote wasn't taken out of context all all?

blahblahblah, same old talk, ignoring the facts and stuff. all can see you started to compare skills firsts, and you were the only to do it.

we we're talking a+b, then you added c in form of rapha, and after that you were using "we're comparing skills" quote refering to a+b. out of fucking context

I love how the guy who accuses me of "ignoring the facts" systematically misrepresents what was actually said to save face. Since you've decided to repeat the same claim that I already addressed and debunked, let me explain to you again how things actually went:

- in response to your earlier posts, I told you that "not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players".
- you replied that the reason you were looking at achievements ("strenx didnt win a lan. evil did.") was to "measure player skill". You linked this to your comparison by reiterating that strenx had not won a lan and that this fact was "important".
- I responded to that by saying that we were not comparing careers, giving the example of the rapha and evil match to illustrate my point that two players can be very close in skill despite having a world of difference between them in terms of achievements.
- Finally, you replied to me by addressing my sentence "we're not addressing careers". You addressed this sentence by clarifying what you had been doing all along in our exchange, and said "we're comparing skills. one of objective ways to measure skill is to check achievements."

This last sentence was therefore you clarifying what your argumentation was about, regardless of the rapha vs evil example I brought up. You had indeed already partly clarified your stance in the previous post, before I ever mentioned rapha, when you explained for the first time why you were looking at achievements ("to measure skill"). In this post, you clarified it further because you were replying to my sentence "we're not comparing careers".

Face it, you can't escape your own words, and I've clearly shown they were not taken out of context in any way.

srsly, cba to talk with a guy whos iq is lower than my dog's, so:

i fucking said its out of context just to dish you, and get more time to pwn your delusional "we're comparing skills" bullcrap comments. but apparently, as you're just a little belgian whore, with no sense of dignity, you will never back off, no matter how much rape i will give you.

just die in a fucking carfire, no harm dont to humanity then.

Oops, looks like someone has seen his last hope at a semblance of an argumentative defense so utterly destroyed that he's going to have to get the fuck out of the thread with his tail between his legs. Bye! :)

tail between legs? yet another delusion of yours. thats exactly why i got bored by you. you make up things instead of reading what i just said.

facts in this conversation:

you tried to prove im wrong 3 times in this conversation. you did fail twice. its 2:0 in bo3 series, no need and fun to play 3rd map against dumbass like you.

I've replied to every single one of your "arguments", and we've clearly seen that you're completely unable to put forward anything that looks even remotely close to a valid defense of your debunked "out-of-context" claim. You've been destroyed so bad all you have left is insults (well, one could argue you didn't have much else to begin with either). Your attempts at saving face are laughable - just get out.

ye, whatever voices in your head are saying.

just dont forget to visit a doctor and get some pills. they will help. probably

That's right little scrub, keep telling yourself nobody will notice you've abandoned all hope of actually defending your position! We both know you have nothing, just stop embarrassing yourself by trying to save appearances with insults :)

blah blah, at least now you're saying something fresh, instead of repeating same delusional horsecrap all the time.

The same exact arguments I presented you with are still there - you never managed to counter them, and your attempts at responding to them failed so much you had to resort to ignoring my debunking completely and focus on presenting me only with insults instead. I understand that having been proven wrong by your own words must have been quite a blow, but you'd think you'd have learned your lesson by now.

Considering you've admitted your defeat on the argumentative level and are now only insulting/trying to turn your debacle into a last-minute troll attempt, you'll be booted out of the thread by repeatedly reminding you of your argumentative failure and defusing your feeble insults :) Seriously, what a failure you are.

Considering you've admitted your defeat on the argumentative level

i just love how delusional you are :D

Do reply on the argumentative level, then. I'm still waiting.

i did multiple times, all the anwsers you're looking for are here.

just read and dont over interpret

Again, I replied to, and debunked, every single one of your so-called arguments, this post being the latest example. Still waiting.

forgot to remind you about skiping your false assumptions :S

Yes, I already mentioned how you were trying to turn your utter debacle into a last-minute troll attempt. Still waiting.

what troll attempt? another false assumption of your delusional mind?

thats why i dont want to talk with you anymore: you're sick and need help. fast. otherwise you will drown in the waters of your mind.

however, considering it may actually help your therapy, i decided to anwser once more.

-not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.

your false assumption number one, but im quite sure you already know it was stupid of you.

you replied that the reason you were looking at achievements ("strenx didnt win a lan. evil did.") was to "measure player skill".

you were the first to measure skills, with your initial post, when you said strenx is very good because he was able to stand against top players like cypher avek etc etc.

it was also your second false assumption, however it was triggered by my rather sloppy choice of words. i did not compare strenx and evil achievements. at best i did compare their highest rankings in a lan tournament, but considering i did earn more money than 80% of ql duel players, i belive its rather shit way to describe someone's skill. so basiclly you did overinterprate my words.

anything more?

obviously you will ignore all my explanations, but its np, you're mentally ill after all.

You know, you can keep repeating "false assumption" all you want, it won't magically make it true.

Unsurprisingly, you do not address what I clearly explained a few posts ago, and instead go back to your claim that you were not comparing skills (this time quoting me, which doesn't support your argument at all).

I like how you declare you "did not compare strenx and evil achievements", when you're the one who explained that this was exactly what you were doing: see here. Or perhaps do you want a direct quote? Here:

usually ppl take achievements into consideration when you want to measure player skill... so yeah, strenx didnt won a lan, and its important.

So, now that it's clear that you were indeed comparing achievements (even if it was only achievements in terms of who got a 1st place at a major lan), why exactly were you doing so? Well, you already answered that yourself in your own quote: "to measure player skill". Do you want additional confirmation? Let's let hitsu confirm this for us, then:

we're comparing skills. one of objective ways to measure skill is to check achievements.

There! That's settled. To sum up, you compared evil and strenx in your first post by saying evil had won a lan and strenx not (this was before my first post), and then felt the need in to reply to me first to repeat what you had said earlier (so it's not suddenly a different claim based on what I said, contrary to what you're trying to argue) and then to clarify it by explaining that you were looking at achievements to measure, and compare, skill. Further detail can also be found in my previous post, which like I said you conveniently did not address. Nobody's over-interpreting anything - you're just trying to distance yourself from your own words which stated clearly your intent. And it's not working - too bad!

funneh you totally skipped first part of my comment, so you are capable of seeing your failures.

yes, ppl take achievements into consideration when they compare skills. but as i explained i did not compare them. i even said at one point evil has to few lans to be evaluated this way. but yeah, belive what you want, if it makes you happy.

dont really care about imaginations of some random internet guy.

What part of your comment am I supposed to have "skipped"? What argument of yours did I fail to completely debunk? I just explained thoroughly to you why at no point did I make any "false assumption".

I don't need to "belive what [I] want" - your own words confirm I am correct, and I clearly explained why your "out-of-context" claim was bs. You have shown yourself to be completely incapable of answering my debunking.

Yes, I'm sure that you don't care now that you've repeatedly made a complete idiot of yourself ,-)

more of your delusional bullshit.

you skipped the part when you accused me of "not winning a major lan doesn't prevent you from getting compared to other players.". dunno how such brilliant faggot as you, could not notice it.

its also funny how, because of lack of arguments, you just went from "we're comparing skills" to "out of context. which i actually did admit it was just a decoy.

srsly m8 -> you need some good pils

If you think I skipped it, it means you're not understanding this discussion at all (try reading the posts more slowly, perhaps it'll help). My sentence rests on the two links I mentioned earlier, one of which is the fact that you were comparing skills. You are disputing that you were comparing skills, and I have proved to you that you were. By proving that link to be true, I am supporting the validity of the sentence you quoted. Do you get it now? If you don't, try re-reading our conversation, because you obviously have huge comprehension problems/have completely lost sight of the argument that is being made.

You actually were back to claiming that you were not comparing skills, and so far your only defense against my clear evidence that you were comparing skills had been your out-of-context argument. Now that you've dropped it (easy to call it a "decoy" after it's been destroyed), you have no argument whatsoever to contest the fact that you indeed compared skills, since your own words prove that you did.

It seems that you understand this exchange even less than I thought. Fascinating.

lots of text, no content

Like I said, read it as many times as you need until you get it. Still waiting.

wait, im outta here. define this as a "victory", hope you get better anytime soon

No need for me to "define" it as anything - the situation is pretty clear. You tried to argue and failed miserably, repeatedly making an idiot out of yourself, and you're now getting out of the thread because you don't even have a semblance of an argument to hold on to, having gotten completely shut down. Again: bye!

What a wall of irrelevant text.

You can't win every argument. :>

max 5 posts and he will get assraped

Are you idiot or?

i made mistake, it took more than 5 posts :S

getting old i guess

Looks like you didn't even have the balls to run out of the thread with your tail between your legs without first pretending to someone else you had "won" the discussion. I can't say I didn't see it coming ,-)

all you saw coming is my dick in your ass.

I don't know, a scenario in which your dick is anywhere to be seen sounds pretty unlikely to me.

You should learn your quake history. Evil attended several lans in q3 aswell, among others eswc 2004. Didnt do to well though. He is way more experienced then strenx when it comes to quake.

pretty sure he won a few events in quake3

Yes, quite a few. Including the all mighty russian pros that played back then. :)

In terms of first place finishes,

evil's the second most successful player in the ASUS Cup duel championships. (First being Cypher all time)

(evil's tied with cypher as the two most successful players in the ASUS Q3[not QL] duel championships.)

3 Grandmasterstrenx France 2561
4 Grandmasterevil Russia 2548

/THREAD LOL!!!!!

:D

hi strenx

strenx-beat-evil-in-a-bo7-not-that-long-ago-he-takes-lg-fights-against-him-and-wins-straight-up-evil's-rise-is-a-result-of-the-tourney-scene-dying-and-players-not-practicing-there's-a-reason-nobody-saw-evil-at-a-lan-b4-shootmania-was-released

strenx-ping-rapes-most-of-his-competition-so-his-online-success-is-irrelevant.-do-it-on-lan.-also,-some-players-are-known-to-step-up-their-game-quite-a-bit-for-lans(cypher)

no. evil is good. why he didnt play before 2011-2012 is a mystery

It's not like Memento_Mori to create potential shitstorm threads!

lol possibly a chance of a sharknado too.

what in the actual fuck

lol so ridiculous i may have to watch it.

why some things go viral and others don't -- shrug. I think comedian/roaster Anthony Jeselnik helped get this absurd but toothy waterspout going.

Still can't touch the Singham though. Probably the only man Mr. Norris fears.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giJCL_jhnsE

Thanks for that rofl

You have to check this out too:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esmSrXMDJxs

Sneaky motivations why he's so good:
He adapts to his opponent. To his style, his abilities and his in-fight decisions and moves. Evil's gambles and pushes depends on the opponent too.
His style hides his flaws. Always pushing or trying to catch your opponent with his pants down means he won't have time to catch you out with your back turned. Evil moves a lot around the map and Rapha showed he's a little prone to that like everyone else.
Closing the distance every time hides the fact he doesn't like to use the railgun even if he's very good with it and it's possible to counter Evil with rails.
Evil's offensive rockets are mind blowing, expecially if he has a pillar or something to hide behind. Take an RL off the spawn and try to rush your opponent Evil's style, you'll embarass yourself.
And he's so fucking fast in everything he does.

Blatant motivations why he's so good:
You know them.

The formatting in these replies are terrible :(

he doesn't fear his opponent, he's just too damn confident in his raw ability to out-damage anyone he plays

he has no emotional attachment to the game whatsoever

also he's not a scared bitch to +back like 95% players in quake nowdays :)

he is playing quake like it was meant to be played

Why are people making a big deal of evil's +forward game but not av3k's +forward game? Evil seems a bit more reckless to me, but av3k had a calculated +forward game that blew my mind...

Emphasis on had. He stopped playing like that a long time ago.

as if he did a 180° on his playstyle..

why aren't people making a big deal about you not playing ql anymore :[

wasn't ziel just an item whore with weaker aim than dahang?

That's what I remember about him... nothing too impressive BUT it is always a shame to lose a higher level dueler in the NA scene

<3

yeah but av3k never dominated ql like evil + he unfortunately always got pwnt by rapha then cried on stream and quit lans

steroids and russian olympic team training

Too me hes the best all around player.

Deletion requested by user.

-back?

vo0 is +move he just goes all over maps like cpma style I think

+moveleft +moveright school

lol

+moveforwardmegaaggressive

"Compared to other games, QL duel has been considered for years to favor +back style." Im guessing these "styles" that work can also move from one end to another when overall skill level increases etc.
Theres a way to play better quake than the #1 atm plays. If its more aggro or passive, than lets say rapha at the moment, nobody knows..

Game like this are so incredibly complex, that its really hard to say anything for certain.

Interesting topic and some nice replies!

it doesnt work vs +backing cunts like rapha that land a lucky rocket that sends you to lava which in turn kills you and your 8 mins of near perfect game and loses you the qcon.

Solution:remove dm13 from map pool!

Remove rockets

speaking of luck if t4 was in the map pool evil would have lost 2to1 to zero4

evil has played plenty of t4 against the best russians

Rapha was the better player at dm13, evil hit rapha in the face with a rocket early on which gave him control. Almost 8 minutes of control and he didnt manage to make one single frag despite stack advantage. If you think its as easy as just +back with rl against a stacked evil you are clueless. Rapha made sure he was aware of evils whereabouts the whole game, dealing damag every now and then, getting item timings etc.

Yes his rocket that made evil fall into lava was quite lucky but he still played better overall then evil. If evil played a perfect 8 minutes as you claim he should have made a few frags aswell.

its kinda dumb to label rapha as +back. He does 3 things better than anyone else:

1. Consider all possibilities in a situation and guarding against all of them (thats why its so hard to surprise him and get a frag)

2. Time everything to the second whenever possible and having an extreme level of understanding of how long it takes from one point of the map to another for himself and the enemy

3. Having an extremely good judgement of whats over-committing and whats not: he does not simply +back, he shows up everywhere needed and tries to deal damage but he pulls out of a situation BEFORE it goes bad, other players seem to suck at this.

I think one strengths that really separates him and a few others from the rest is the ability to judge the stacks.

Avek said in an interview how rapha was the first to really push this to the actual numbers. Personally, I had the chance to sit next to rapha as he was playing, and he would tell me the damage he was doing and the stacks of the opponent with a precision I did not think possible, considering also health bubbles etc... Awareness over 9000.

I know, it's sick!

knowing stack of opponent is not hard, however damage you do is tricky as hell.

You can cheat a little using the premium scoreboard. Esp. in the beginnings of a game or if you used a weapon you havent used before during the game you can easily learn how much damage you did exactly.

Beyond that when you have enough experience you start to feel how much stack your opponent has pretty well. All pro players know how much stack their opponent has at any point during the game +-50health/armor. And knowing it precisely wouldn't be such a big advantage since damage output in fights is so unpredictable. Anyway, I think memento is overrating that aspect quite a lot. From having played rapha what really seperated him was his great map awareness, timing and decision making. Knowing the enemy stack exactly might help him once every 5 games or so.. ;)

But it adds up to the extra info he has, like counting ammo (rockets in particular) and timing bubbles and shards (he said he can time up to 5 times to the second)

Nobody times 5 items to the second, at least not in the way people on esr seem to imagine it. What players mean when they say they can time 5 items to the second is that they know the order in which the items will spawn and what route they took when taking them so they have a clear picture in their head when the items will spawn in relation to one another. Then it is enough to know when one item will spawn to the second to be able to tell when the others spawn exactly. F.e. I play t7, take red at 15, then go pick up rail ya, continue with mega ya, and take the mega. Then if you paused the game and asked me I could probably tell you after some thinking exactly when the items will spawn. However, it's not like one will maintain the times in his head "red 15, railya 18, megaya 24...".

To the actual point: yes of course it is extra info that helps you make decisions, but you would usually make decisions based on enemy is low/not low, not if he has 110/130 or 120/140. Knowing the exact stack more precisely will only help in some very specific situations.

Deletion requested by user.

I saw vo0 on his stream trying to time 4 items. He lost timing a lot, and could only keep it up for a few minutes at a time.

Definitely seems like you risk forgetting or mixing up the timings for the RA and mega if you're concentrating on yellows or whatever.

Point is ze raffer thinks about more aspects and he does it in numbers as well, precision for taking decisions and playing less risky. The next level required for better strategies.

About timing, ofc there's a lot of simplification and everyone uses plenty of methods at the same time in order to not forget when items are spawning (feel, 'circle of the items', rounding numbers up, exact second), Personally I only time to the second up to 2 items (usually 0 as I almost always fool around), but serious mode rapha, czm, spartie and agent most probably do 3 or even more and in a more precise way than I do.

cheaters

"extreme level of understanding of how long it takes from one point of the map to another for himself and the enemy" you guys seem to under-estimate this factor. Most top players do this very well but rapha is just at whole another level of this, he does not try to to show up somewhere and see if its too early or too late for being at an advantage, he KNOWS this before he tries to do so. Rapha only gets thrown off this, when someone does a crazy rare RJ to get to somewhere which usually should take longer.

I have been watching rapha play since 2007, back when he was not a star and used to practice hard with griffin, mongo and walter. From the very first time I saw him play I could tell this guy was for the long haul since he had the best out of control play and mental resilience only comparable to cooller but even better at controlling emotion / stupid decisions than cooller. I believe he watched a lot of cooller/lexer demos at that period but also added his own personal flavor.

Though I am a big fan of rapha I still prefer to watch someone like evil because he just does crazy shit that should not normally work but he makes it work, it takes a lots of raw skill to do that and he has that.

It's not about how big the +forward is, it's how you use it.

Posting in a hitsu thread.

Most threads sooner or later becomes hitsu threads

I was actually thinking the exact same thing when I came upon your post.

hope you cleaned up afterwards

not me that has to do the cleaning up.

it's all aiming

ONLY AIMING

ofc, there is a lot of things coming into the whole aiming deal, like special movement, thinking, positioning during fights (even if it comes to evil it's not just a dumpest shooting and firing while the crosshair is on the enemy... it's smth more), but at the end of the day it's only aim that lets him do that +forward geme)

aka combat skills or execution

I'll explain this a simple as i can. Rapha could be spamming a corridor and evil knows the only way to attack him is from that corridor because there is no other position avaliable. He thinks will i hit him easier than he will at me if i be aggressive with my dodging? is my aim/stack good enough to make this move? is this move unexpected? Will taking this risk have a bigger a reward in the end (similar stack, enemy has position to get both item, take risk so you don't give him full control), will i deal more dmg here than rapha will from that position?How does rapha like to play (spam a lot, stay at corners for a long time expecting me to double back)? is my aim better than his and should i take this fight? is rapha's aim not so good that i can be aggressive with my dodging with a lower stack? have i tried this move before and what happened? I think he likes to be ultra-aggressive online to see what moves can work and what won't. He also does this thing where he hears enemy switch from lg to rocket after an initial confrontation where both are behind a wall and when he hears the enemy switch weapons that gives him the signal that the enemy thinks he left the area. Then he does thing where he takes fights he knows he will probably die from so he can contest for the next item. Also he takes a lot of fights If there's two or more corridors because it gives more of an advantage to the aggressive player because he can come from either one of those.

TL;DR you need to choose situations when to be aggressive and when not to be aggressive.

So much irrelevant bs in this thread.

Brah... dat how dis goes!

Jeah!

Brah?!

His tactics are unpredictable and his aim is fucking killer.

END OF STORY.

That being said, I think QL can "look" like it favors a more defensive style. Probably does, but I'm not so sure yet.

DaHanG is pretty goddamn offensive. Rapha is both lol

Nobody in NA has aim like Evil at the highest levels of play. I was amazed peeps were saying he was having a bad day on his first day of the tournament. I was wondering "DA FUK YOU TALKING ABOUT... YOU SEE DAT NUGGA DO DIS, DAT, AND DA OTHER THING?"

But he probably was having a bad day. That is frightening.

Evil kind of reminds me of CZM a little.

Rapha is probably the best player in Q3/Live history though IMO.

C'mon jews. Ahem, I mean XOU!

Grow some balls! Say something! Tell me how dumb I am!!!


Rahhha!!! *hulk lifts dog and puts him back down *

... and Chance IMO could be the best player in NA.

Everybody can laugh at me, but I think he could be. It's so fun just speculating about things!

He should play CPM! The best duel game in history! His RL is killer.

Evil's preparation methods before quakecon 2013 - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y3SnCwSZbI8

Agent was also to appear, but some idiots made him miss the flight.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=mqORtBW210U

evil is +back (old school) with sudden +fwd at times, positions and angles other players don't attack. Some of those times are based on item spawns, others in having some players studied.

Also his movement (speed) and his rockets are some of the best in the game. His basic skills are not just lg with zoomnudge.

Though his style is not surprsing as before, or can be countered or dealt with, as he lost the two last lan finals he played, against cooller and rapha. DH:W will be crucial in his 'career', now that people are watching his demos, expect the dmg output and aren't pseudo retired from quake anymore,