2rd

Only time this comment makes any sense.

exposed

You play against bots without dodge.... Useless thread/clip/test

im waiting for new quake coze ql is lost with 70% f.....g cheating idiots like jIm231 :/. i hope new quake will have good anticheat. Happy new year to all clean playaz

You must have missed the part where I said that I haven't used this against unaware human opponents. Still, that's why I chose to do this under a fake name - I'm sure someone would misinterpret it and go "oh, that explains why he kills me - he was cheating."

But yes, it is a little depressing that I just renewed my pro account two days ago and then found out how people could be using this on a fairly large scale :(.

This is the internet and you are allowed to say fuck here.

Hell, they even track it for you here on ESR!

just stop playing CA

Don't try to bring science into something so stupid.

Trying to sell aimbots?

Nope. This is free, and I only found it yesterday. Been out for quite a while too :(.

I actually found it by looking at the google cache version of agent_smith's thread. I still don't want to repeat it here though. id software should definitely be aware of it already.

This is true, if people remember the color bot, that was giving people 80 percent LG, id did nothing, so I asked one of the people that were using what is it he says color bot its basically a script, I google color bot quake live and it literally was the first website, I posted a link on the id forums, they instantly banned me but color bot magically vanished. It was a blatant cheat and just devastating public games, so even something that was so obvious required a huge push for id to do something and apparently it was an easy fix on id's end because they actually stopped it. The sad thing was it was quite obvious I never even used it because I had no abnormal LG games at all. I am ok with having sacrificed for it though since it actually went away.

They would have fixed it anyways if you had just e-mailed them about it.

Whats wrong with forum??Not like hes encouraging cheats, just speaking openly to everybody.. its a problem that concerns all of us.

The forum is public. Posting a link to hacks is advertising, inadvertent or not.

It's also clearly stated in the forum rules.

There will always be hacks. Even if there was a team of 100 devs working full time on stopping cheating, there would still be hacks. Advertizing them is the worst possible thing the community can do.

Just look at dice with battlefield 3. THey had 200 - 250 devs working on the game and they had massive cheat problems. They never caught they cheat devs until one of the cheat makers friends told dice how to stop them.

Consider then that ID has one dev working on QL.

DICE isnt a particularly good example though ;>

Combine them with EA, and Battlefield 4 is born...

Well it is a decent comparison. Dice had a multi million dollar budget for the game and had at least 200 people working on it. There was this one cheat making "company" that they knew the name of since it was up on their forums and the cheaters were on the forums too. Yet still they couldn't get rid of them.

Expecting IDs one guy to do what +200 dice devs couldn't do is ridiculous.

Yes. It's very hard to fight these companies currently, it's a bit a waste of time...

Agreed, blatant sales tactics are blatant.

http://www.quakelive.com/#!profile/statistics/jlm231

You do realize you can be banned for using 3rd party applications to gain an unfair advantage within the game. Practice match, or not.

That's fine. If I'm a sacrifice for revealing this nasty cheat to the community, I can find other ways to spend my time (and money). I am sincere in saying that I haven't used it against unknowing opponents though.

It doesn't matter, I'm just letting you know. I'm not calling you a cheater, but using cheats in practices or real games is not allowed.

That's something you should have thought about earlier.

Look I fucked up, I regret it.. Move on with it, gave it a shot, blew it.

This shit is old news, grow up.

ur not moving anywhere, cheater.

I'll move wherever I want.

1. He didn't say he was moving anywhere. He told Laim to move on...
2. You have zeroql in your buddy list, how funny. Did you throw the same speech at him?

lol u dump lot, no?!?!

i can't tell the difference.

CONCLUSION: you cheat

prolly the 2nd one cuz u so nonchelantly walk around like you dont have to put any effort in.

but then again, this thread is retarded and you sound like you are advertising cheats. you are a bad person and you should feel bad.

I'm more looking for ideas on how people can spot this in the wild. After using this and then watching certain North American players (cough, dynamicmode, cough), I'm positive either this or very similar bots are being used.

" u so nonchelantly walk around like you dont have to put any effort in." - definitely a good tell. That's the sort of thing I'm fishing for in this post.

I can see your point but still this isn't really the best way to prove your point.

Well, I'm not proving much of a point other than "it can be difficult to spot this hack".

I do plan on following up with a list of tells that people had (more from the reddit posts than ESR), and potentially how to spot others using it.

Well you were trying to prove a point but downloading cheats isn't really the way to do it. Imagine if you would have been caught by some anti cheat software and then been banned. Who would believe you when claiming that you weren't going to cheat?

If I got banned, I'd just move on to other games. In the mean time, I'm gathering evidence on people who I am almost positive are using this in public games.

Seriously serious ?

:D

Yes, serious. Tell me what you think gives it away.

It's only one of the videos in which I'm using an aim assist program. Please let me know what makes you think #2 is obvious.

I'd say the first one. Adjustments seem to be more mechanical and based on patterns. I suppose it would be more visible against human opponents.

Hello agent_smith.

I'd say video 1 'cuz of the movement.

itt: people giving a cheater advice on how to hide his cheats

Totes, a competent programmer would never come to these conclusions on his own while testing this shit. That's why he's competent, see. At programming.

And yes, this comment is intentionally sexist.

Meh. Here's a contribution to the improvement of the community if you don't believe me - http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=B_w3NUI3...p;vq=hd720 (dynamicmode, very clearly wallhacking).

aaaaaaaaaaand he's banned.

number 1 is your man

People shitting on this guy but people would find the cheats with or without this thread. I'd like to know exactly how these aimbots look so I can spot them...

1st video is an aimbot one, 2nd - clear
so obvious

i didn't think humans could get any worser....

i dont care about cheters, in cs 1.5 i was always blamed for cd aim wall and i was just a fucken lucker

#2

You should redo the test with this:

Use skill 5 bots, bot_challenge 1 and bot_thinktime 0.

This will at least make them dodge much better and then we can hope to see something. The problem here is that your LG against them is already extremely good, like much better than it would be against any reasonably dodging human.

Also if you could:

cg_lightningimpact "0"
cg_lightningstyle "4"
cg_drawgun "2"
cg_gunZ "-8"
cg_gunX "-10"
cg_gunY "2.7"

That would help with the visibility on what's going on a smidge. This for when you record the clip. Use whatever you use when recording the game of course.

I actually did not know about the bot commands. Thanks - I will use those when I mess with mouse settings.

I don't think I'll do another test though - people figured out some important tells already.

I would like to see a vid with real players.

Ahh, what are the tells?

I'd prefer a remake to make the tells more pronounced.

http://www.esreality.com/post/2537767/ - a bunch are listed there. The prominent ones, in my opinion, are that when an opponent jumps, it tracks them vertically way more than human aim does, and it decides to lock on to things that the human might not intend.

Some others called out that the bot has a frequent tendency to undercorrect when tracking, whereas most humans tend to overcorrect more often.

I spot the cheat shit threat.

Is it a shit rope we all now have to climb, or more shit-eagles shitting comming to shit on us all?

I'd say either vid 1 or none of both.

both

number one

I don't any aimbot on either of videos.

reminds of http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1715599#pid2162396

aimbot fagget detected: jlm231

I don't think this thread is intentionally made to spread the use of cheats, nor that it's indirectly doing it.
The cheating level is already out of scale, and many of those cheats are so sofisticate and finely tunable that they are, to all the effects, almost undetectable.

And the most used kind of cheat, anyway, isn't the aimbot, but the wallhack, that sadly, expecially for the kind of game Quake is, is almost considered a standard, today.
Not that using it in a game like Call of Duty or Counter Strike would be less bad, but a fast paced, tactical game like Quake loses half of his deepness with the ability to predict, to see, around corners and to spot incoming rushes, items and whatsoever trough walls.

It becomes a COD clone, and a bad one.
If you also have an aimbot, even setted at a very low percentage of accuracy, it just comes down to mere wrath towards other players, skill envy, the willness to be better than how someone is at all costs.

Cheats hurts oneself, before hurting others.

Bacause this is the real reson cheats are used, at least by the non-newbies: experienced players became annoyed by the unpredictability of the game, the randomness that inevitabily makes creazy things to happens, lucky rockets on the face behind a corner, a quad runner taken down in a second by a noob with two casual rockets, the constant feelining of insecureness and nervousness generated by a player that you don't consider at your level fooling yourself by continuosly dodging in and out a door frame, your prey, or at least what you consider that, escaping nonchalantly running away at full speed with his defenseless back turned at you, pretected by the walls and the fact you aren't sure if he's turned away or just waiting for your face to rail it as soon as you try to have a visual on him, all of these things, that nonetheless are always existed in every quake, in any other game, and to the contrary, are the salt of the gameplay, all of those things had the hateable consequence of creating a leveled, equal field of skills and situations usable to makes an experienced, skilled player to be fragged, or just hurt, by a noob, or a less skilled player.

The real market, the real backbone of the serious, evolved, and even under payment, cheats aren't the noobs, or those morons that runs around in ffa with 50% lg aimbots, but the long time players, the ones that are playing by years, daily, that have a clan (the natural source of whatever you need ) and "a name", for ridicolous it is to have "a name" in a mere videogame.

Those are the majority of peoples that needs to own noobs, that can't stand the work, the hardness of natural aiming, that can't accept to be fooled around a corner, that doesn't want to hold back the aggressiveness and the relentless attacking because of the possibility of a defensive +back rocket or grenade well placed.
That can't or doesn't want to waste mental energies in timing items, only to see them stolen by nobodies that have practiced it or that are simply more talented (or less old: the average age is way higher in quake, because peoples have started playing years ago, and have stuck with it; and now they can't accept, "after all those years!" to see youngsters better at everything after just some months, knowing they can only get worse the more they age).

No, it isn't acceptable. Every kind of mental excuse is generated to justify cheats usage.

But here comes the problem, and the real reason id software doesn't lift a finger to prevent the problem, and actually even resorts to ignoring or banning the peoples that reports cheaters: because the majority of the cheaters are paying customers, have pro accounts, and are the ones generating profit.
No profit, no quake.
No quake, no quake for anybody.
Even in the cases cheaters aren't paying customers because the time expired, those players are still between the most active ones, the more socially active, etc., so are the ones generating more games and the most loyal customers.
Again, profit generators.
Actually banning all the cheats accounts, or just half of them, would result in the definitive killing of the system.
For ridicolous it may sound, if there's still quake, it's thanks to cheaters & friends.
So no, there won't be a solution, a different one from just claiming "there are no cheaters in ql", "the last time i've seen a cheater was 2008", "turn on sound( audio or sound has become a synonimous of wallie)", "l2p", "give proof", or the funniest ones "i don't see a 60%aimbot there, must be legit".
Noobs will drink it, and if they don't, they can leave, they aren't the most active players.
Things won't change, or will even become worst.
But anyone will be happy, except the ones that are skilled enough to want to play clean with clean opponents.
Or just for the sake of it, for the principle to play the game as it is intended, and not with the "new standard".

But there's nothing that can be done, not all the stories ends well.


Too long, dind't read:

Cheats nowadays can be so refined to be almost undetectable; the major part of the users aren't skilless noobs, but experienced, long time players; those players are the backbone of the paying customers, and the most active users; id would be auto-lesionistic in banning the most loyal, paying and playing players, that constitutes a percentage big enough the game would die without; so nothing will change, reporting cheaters is useless or may result in banning for the reporter; just deal with it, and actually thanks the paying cheaters, if the game is still alive.


Still too long, didn't read.

It is what it is, and it would be worse without cheaters, so deal with it or find something else to play.

id would be auto-lesionistic in banning the most loyal, paying and playing players, that constitutes a percentage big enough the game would die without; so nothing will change, reporting cheaters is useless or may result in banning for the reporter

lol

That sure is a whole lot of text defending people who promote these cheats and apologise for that shit. How d'you feel? Did it feel good to get that out of your system or did you have to strain?
The only people who should be "allowed" to download and analyse this shit are developers, not random internet heroes.

I don't think this thread is intentionally made to spread the use of cheats, nor that it's indirectly doing it.

I once caught some crazy bug and shatpuked everywhere. I didn't mean it, but it still happened. Gnomesayin'. Real talk.

edit: nm

I'm not defending peoples who promote cheats, at all.
To the contrary, this thread has been made to denounce the actual situation, if anyhting it is harmful on peoples using cheats.

Anyway, it's always better to be informed, i think. To know what's going on. Even if it can't change anything.

My post was just intended to enlight some peoples that still ignore that problem, or just to incentivate reasoning on the subject.
Sorry if it appeared as someone else, but it's not.

I see no aimbots on both :/

Second one is using aimbot.

Why?

He never overextends his crosshair movement or anticipate the movement.

Look at the first clip from 0:28 to 0:30. You can see how he anticipates the movement of the enemy going right before actually moves.

This is part of the dodging pattern your brain ends up doing a rough calculation on based on earlier movement and is also the difference on how your brain works and how all humanised aimbots work. A humanised aimbot does not anticipate movement but instead always lags behind the hitbox with the desired accuraccy value. Just like in the second clip.

We humans instead anticipate the objects movement. Some do it better because of more practice, some due to better genes but that common thing is that we all do mistakes and end up missing eventually.

Also it should be noted that these clips are relatively short and the dodging is a joke. A good aimer with low sensitivity can hit these accuracies with easy but will eventually start overextending the crosshair movement after some minutes. Ever heard of a tired aimbot?

I see your point. Doesnt mean anything to me i still think no aimbot on both vids. Also if you think bots never anticipate then you probably never played cpma deathbot.

You could be right. Second video can be legit since it's short and the dodging is bad. All I am saying is that over aiming by such a margin is most likely not a scripted sequence.

No I have not played cpma deathbot. I would still find it strange that an aimbot would have been designed to deliberately miss by so much as in the first clip. The mistakes we do while anticipating movement has always been something that I found strange that these aimbot makers left - which leads me to think that they really don't have a clue how players aim or that they missed out on asking for decent input.

or that they missed out on asking for decent input.

well they asked zeroql, that was a start

Then he made a tutorial movie for them.

I can see a ban.