cypher and sarcasm lololol

for those of us that haven't played qc (yet), what is it like to play high stack champions vs low stack champions? for example, clutch scalebearer sorlag vs slash anarki nyx (or doom)?

it feels like hell on earth

No one likes this garbage and I fear what happened to SC2 will happen to QC, they'll only start making the drastic changes necessary many years too late.

SC2 ? I remember when SC2 was launched and the year after, that was just MASSIVE. I hope QC does the same TBH.

Game was out in 2010... This last Sunday, the French only stream for the HomestoryCup had 2,5 K viewers. Not so bad.

I hope QC does the same TBH.

I don't

Because you don't want it to be successful, or because you want it to be more successful than SC2 after 10 years ?

I'd rather the most successful quake game not be a quake parody

Oh, the edgy purist card, this meme is old enough now, seriously. And I thought I was a reactionary guy... May I ask what kind of game would be pure enough to deserve to be popular as a Quake / Arena FPS game then ?

Quake Champions isn't ideal but it's here, and it won't move, so I don't see how the whole Quake franchise couldn't benefit from it becoming successful. I already said that in another thread but despite its flaws, it's still miles away from gameplay like OW, CSGO or PUBG which are boring to death to play and spectate imo and which require much less different skills so it should be represented along with these games in big tournaments imo. Quake Live, which is my personal favourite, won't come back, and they certainly won't make another Quake game now - which is VERY similar to other Quake in almost every aspect anyway except duel format / strategy - so we have to make with what he have now.

I can understand all the bashing and hate for the game, but I don't see how wanting it to fail as much as possible is justified considering the options. What would you have liked ? Only Quake Live with new graphics ? No timers, 30s delay in TDM, etc. etc. ? You'd rather see Quake in a closet forever, keeping pure enough while nobody gives a fuck or even knows it, than having an imperfect Quake being promoted to the masses and potentially benefiting old titles for curious people then ? It's weird.

There's absolutely nothing "edgy" or "purist" about what I wrote.

I'd have preferred if they released a game with the core actually functional? Yes, I appreciate that it's in BETA, but there's so many of the basics missing. Even things like the ability to change your crosshair was missing for fuck sake. Physics and netcode tied to framerate, laggy interpolation, lack of direction. There are many "core" things that are wrong with the game.

Yes, innovation is good and trying new things isn't inherently bad, but "abilities", the new duel format, lack of other team gamemodes is bad. I find CSGO and PUBG to be 10000x more fun to play, spectate and participate in than QC without any doubt whatsoever.

Making something "new" just to appeal to the masses and promoting a shit game just to keep "Quake" in the big titles is just pointless imo. If this is the direction the game has taken, I'd rather them not continue the franchise. It's like when producers tarnish a great film with a shit sequel.


EDIT: And where are the things the community have been consistently asking for and implementing for years? Matchmaking? A ranking system? Division between experienced players and new players to prevent a disheartening experience? Spectator functionality? Custom mapping / mods? More server-side options and control?

Where's all of that? Instead we're getting loot boxes and vanity items. I feel like the priorities are wrong and the game was released way too early. It had a lot of potential, but I feel like most of that has now wasted away into an unrecoverable state.

Also, regarding "potentially benefiting old titles for curious people then." Potentially is the key word; if the game's a heap of shit it certainly won't make people want to try the older games.

Sorry about "edgy", that was maybe over the top, but calling QC a "caricature" of Quake definitely sounds purist (which I don't find bad per se). Forgt about that, not important.

We agree on the basic missing, but they said they are working on it. So, it sucks now but I'm still willing to give them more time and see how it evolves. I agree with you about the duel format, and actually I don't mind the abilities much but the different stacks indeed bother me.

Too many team modes isn't good in my opinion, especially if the game doesn't have tons of players. CS:GO or PUBG don't seem to have many game modes, yet you prefer them (this I could never understand why but that's how tastes work I guess so no problem with that).

Matchmaking is in QC, what do you mean exactly ? Ranking system apparently is on its way, division between players is already implemented I think but it definitely needs to be more accurate and strict (better if more players too). Custom maps and modes are great in a way, but then again I'm afraid it would split a small community too much.

Loot box and vanity items is the way they are trying to get some money from the game 24/7. I don't know how that will work but other games like CSGO and PUBG also use this system. I find it bad, but if it allows the game to have more competitions, I'm ready to pass on it.

I'll be your purist.

Duel is fucking ruined. It is boring to play and watch to such and extend that i just don't anymore. That really pisses me off, because I miss the game.

"What would you have liked ? Only Quake Live with new graphics ? No timers, 30s delay in TDM, etc. etc. ? You'd rather see Quake in a closet forever, keeping pure enough while nobody gives a fuck or even knows it..."

You assume your conclusion about the game being forever closeted. I am in no way convinced that a QL with modern graphics, match making, cosmetics (that DON'T affect gameplay), etc., wouldn't be interesting to gamers today.

Unique and great gameplay is what makes a game interesting. You don't achieve that by dumbing yours down and emulating all the others. That's how you become generic and forgettable.

Quake type gameplay is unique nowadays when everybody plays CS dota or OW.

It has always been, which is all the more reason not to bastardise and twist it into something unenjoyable that falls short in every aspect that it tries to be.

Well said.

It won't, Overwatch is the FUCKIN FUTURE. Quake Champions does not have a hope in hell of becoming that big, sorry to say folks.

Actually more like PUBG styíle is the future, became even more successful in a blink of an eye than OW. That basically means the future is survival game + likely military shooter (altho I can imagine a sci-fi shooter being successful too), big map lots of players, but no heroes / champs,

But how long do you think it will last versus OW??!

Any long. Look at CS. That's what the core gameplay is closest to.

Sc 2 was massive shit. It completely destroyed that one time when true esports existed. The venues for korean leagues got empty within a month. Needless to say, it were mostly casuals who kept coming to watch their favorite game and players.
Yes, the game had good population - initially. But most oldschoolers quit within a year and the new players, who got lured in by blizzards hype campaign, left for other games eventually. Overall, Sc2 numbers were bad considering the insane amounts of money Blizz threw into "eehsports" to make people buy their two expansions.
Nowadays SC2 events can still get close to 10k viewers, which is pretty much the same as bw pros were getting on afreeca a year ago. Playing casual games.
BW HD was obviously damage control.

QC is very similar in this regard, the devs ignore the core community that took care of the franchise for ages, and fix what wasnt broken.

I did not play sc2 because bw was Superior, Im not playing qc because ql is superior. Sc2 was okay first, but in that shape it was already worse than bw, and they managed to fuck it into Oblivion with the monthly patches and now it is free to play lol. I'm sure very few people enjoyed it after bw but casuals eat hype for breakfast supper and ... they eat it up all day. I don't see how could anyone take qc or sc2 seriously. When will you see through the obvious marketing crap

honestly, sc2 was average game at best until LotV. most would even say shit.

if it wasn't called "starcraft" no one would give 2 fucks about it. and if blizzard didn't do it's best to kill korean brood war, you wouldn't have half the scene.

Im no SC expert, Id like to know how it was average for you. To me, as a noob, the game felt pretty similar and offered some good possibilities with New technologies like buried bunkers, blink stalkers, etc.

I don't mind simplifying stuff like macro (binding same type of buildings to 1 key, auto worker split, etc). don't even mind the units. what i disliked was blizzard making balance patches 1 day before semifinals of gsl, game being a ball vs ball type of engagement where if u lose the fight u lost the game, etc. with LotV game became what it should've been on release imo.

that's stuff of the top of my head, if i thought more, i'd remember (or if i played it again).

edit: still, sc2 ain't half as bad as sc:r (http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/brood-war/528...-starcraft)

The balance between tech / army / economy was completely skewered, and map features like high-ground advantage were removed for no good reason.

The game is limited strategically compared to the first game, since the economy snowballs too hard (and then caps out fast), has too many early-game defensive gimmicks, and gas is too expensive. Map design has to follow very specific rules, or else the matchups become absurdly dumb or plain imbalanced.

People, some of whom have been playing the franchise since the days of dial-up, have tried for a very, very long time, through incredibly detailed feedback, to explain to the devs how they broke their own game. Stuff like this:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/legacy-of-the...my-of-scii

is responded to by the devs in a very tim willits-esque manner, or outright-ignored.

I used to watch Starcraft 2 all the time after release, but by 2013, I couldn't watch more than 3 minutes of a stream before switching tabs and completely forgetting about it. It's just hollow.

I wounder what he thought of Q4, it must have had the same problem with position and and LG only fights.

Q4 was more aim heavy then Q3 QL, but with good map control and good stack, you were able win.

cooller is the living proof of this.

ps: Also Fatal1ty (haters gonna hate)

and WinD

No map control of the items is hilarious honestly, anyone can reach atleast 80% of a fullstack with fucking ease. Absolute idiots over at ID. Mind you, not like I didn't call it 5 months ago. Good to see it's basically dead.

Again with this retard 'position means nothing'?

You shot the first rocket from a position of advange, you win.

Position is EVERYTHING.

Cheap damage is useless, taking items is useless, flick rails are useless.

You just need to catch someone from a good position and they're dead.

It's not like 200-200 Rapha vs 100-150 Evil in Quake Live. The first one hit a rail, go LG and then get raped by Evil >>>> LG.

Here you take the first shot and you win, that's it.

Got a little secret for you, none of the old QL pro's like QC champions duel.

Got a little secret, i guess atleast 75% dont like qc duel :)

Which makes it tedious to practice.

There's stilll lots of money on the line for duel, so that people should be practicing and streaming duel all day, right? People aren't, because no one can handle experiencing absurd bugs and bad game design situations in half of their matches. The game just feels random.

I agree b a k a s t e n most Pros think it's abysmal. less quality ,more random/bugged

Its not strictly related to pros!

I just want to remind you that your lost world nade jump will forever be in my heart and how much I wish you would make a nice movie for us with heaps of cool tricks in it. <3

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8agRYhvEK4

Not surprised about this, since the start Cypher has not been as interested nor invested as in previous iterations imo.

Not that I'm a pro and my opinion is going to matter but I stopped playing weeks ago and I was one of the first to be superexited about QC, even remaining positive and telling others 'it will be fine' during the first months. Problem is, the longer you play, the more you see the flaws up to the point there is no returning anymore.

Back to my stack of SP games and pubg :D

standard duel with longer item spawn, 15min match, and every champion available after death would be nice ;)

In best of 3s (or 5) you should pick your 3-5 champs, pick maps, and then have 1 champion per map with 10-15 min timelimit. This is similar to the ESCW team duel competition (2004), the Quakecon Quad Damage duel tournament (2007), and less hectic than the current setup of potentially 6 champions per map.

Perhaps pubs can evolve to something casual like pick 1 champ, play until 10 minutes or 10 frags, whichever's first. Then casual players can run around with their favorite doom slayer/clutch/etc champ to their heart's content. The barrier to entry is lower if you only need to practice 1 champion at a time. But for cups and tournaments people will still have to be well rounded and the concept of competition between distinct champions will be preserved, maybe enhanced.

Sometimes it feels like devs are trying to reinvent the wheel just out of sheer stubbornness.

QL with nutty graphics and some new maps and ranked/unranked games would be sick, I guess the champions with the abilities gotta stay but the 3 lives bo5 bullshit gotta go. Just make it 10-15min unlimited lives. Would be a decent start.

> Sometimes it feels like devs are trying to reinvent the wheel just out of sheer stubbornness

Of course they are.

> ??? >>> >

Agree. Love sacrifice but sadly not touching duel in this pathetic format.

I told you idiots months before the game was released but you wouldn't listen:

http://esreality.com/post/2864216/this-game-sucks/

Time to go back to QL/QW.

i almost got banned for calling it shit lol

cypher here



many things cutted from context, the game is not that bad, but duel format doesnt requires anything more then one perfect fight...

cypher here, can confirm that this is cypher

I'm evil and this is definitely real.

gg hitler

^ And that was real agent, folks.

I would know if not, because i'm ash, writing right from the jail, Vladimirsky Central, oh, the norhern wind, transported right from the Tver, - oh, my unspeakable evil - with all the heavy weight lying on my heart...

hitler was a sensitive man

It's ok to be Adam Pyle.

strenx isnt too much of a fan either

hahaha strenx <3

For all his idiocracy I miss strenx drama.

sunday cups without strenx just isn't the same

I enjoy ql more than champs because it's less random and better in every way in general but it's obvious most of the complaint from the pros is directed towards the cpma movement and how it doesn't fit their style. I might change my mind if I hear someone like tox or a pro cpm player who benefits from the movement changes complain about the game.

http://esreality.com/post/2890393/vo0-this-game-is-unplayable/

Didn't voo say in an interview after quakecon saying the reason he said that was because quake champs had a lot of performance issues most of which were resolved and his complaints had nothing to do with the core gameplay?

That could be true.

It's hard to find a pro cpm player complaining about cpm champions though, why would they, nobody likes to see their best champion being nerfed as long as they still have an edge against non-cpm veterans in their anarki play.

I think the fact that there are so many top players who never seriously played CPM but still pick Anarki and Sorlag frequently (Rapha, K1llsen, Spartie, Cypher, Av3k) etc is enough proof that the cpm champs are kind of a must-picks atm, and I feel that the main reason for this is that they are so damn hard to hit with the current netcode and hitboxes.

It's not that the complainers hate playing as Anarki so much, it's more that they hate playing against them because they are so hard to hit, which is really frustrating. Anarki definitely needs to be rebalanced imo, make him hitable but give him more HP or something.

Anarki isn't strong compared to the QW guy or CPM. The movement is capped, you can't circle accel with +forward;+strafe, the armor is ridiculously capped, the health is capped, the weapons are nerfed, half the enemies spawn with 125/50... and suddenly there's this gun called "rail" that's almost like quad shotgun. ;)

http://esreality.com/post/2891670/re-vo0-this...pid2891670

This was the first match of the event. Network wasn't super stable yet; some tweaking had to be done. The game felt a bit choppy. This was resolved later in the day.
Day 2 and day 3 were smooth sailing, very good experience.

I think I know what tox will say :)

https://clips.twitch.tv/SpunkyEnticingGrouseCopyThis

https://clips.twitch.tv/SingleBoldTroutPartyTime

I'm pretty sure, too

I love quake champions, i think its an amazing game that takes players to develop new strategies for de arena shooter style. In my point of view these players who calls it shit are lost in theirs past memories from QL and are now with eyes closed for the new.
We are helping the devs to balance de game, and they are hearing ours suggestions.

Whatever helps u sleep at night I guess.

BR?

duel is awful but they do listen do feedback and they are going to look into it.

game will be fine if its more or less classic duel rules with champions

Since a few months i was asking myself, how they could fuck up the Game on so many Levels. Now i found the truth...

They used a magnet to set individual Bits on a Hard Drive to write the binary of that Game