Hmm... ESEA has their own servers and game clients for CS though right? I don't know if they could extend what they do with CS and other games into QL as easily. Would be interesting to see what would happen if they hosted leagues/ladders.

Yeah they do. It'll be interesting to see what they want to do but I know the owners of ESEA have mentioned it and are obviously interested in extending ESEA into the QL scene. If they do, it will be great for NA QL

there is no NA QL Scene....

could you please provide the numbers to support your claim???

7

nice comment =) but probably an overestimation still

For the record, I was just making fun of that idiot with his little crusader. :)

i know, so was i

8)

i'm an idiot for claiming the na scene is dead? really. lol

1. i have more hours logged than any other na player on ql
2. show me where the activity is then. there are but a handful of na tournaments at any given point in time.
3. tdm is dead, freezetag is dead, insta is dead. ctf, duel and ffa are dying, only ca is played in NA. If you claim otherwise you're just misinformed.

but if you asked me this question earlier last year i would have pointed you to the ql.bot on irc which clearly showed, at the time that euros outnumbered us players 10to1 with the avg # of na players reaching around 100 + full servers. While euro's numbered closer to 1500. If you think that trend has somehow changed then you're just blowing smoke in mirrors.

No, you are an idiot because you felt like doing your old shitty speech we don't care about eventhough I didn't claim anything.

You are the most obsessed retard out there.

says the "retard", (i can play that word game too), who is posting in a "serious" thread. And really if you dont' care about any of these topics, the door is 0-0-------->

At some point, you really should question yourself. Like really.

this is a joke right?

http://quadgaming.us/
CTF: "quad leaving quake live.... due to the lack of community participation"

http://quakeamerica.tourney.cc/
TDM/CTF/Duel tournaments: last post 2/14/2010

http://bibsql.com/
CTF: last tournament with na ctf players, more than a year ago

http://www.fraggednation.com/forum/topic/Nort...-Tag-16114
Freeze TAg: never happened

http://www.fraggednation.com/forum/topics/pc/quake-live
General NA ladders: DOA

There are so many more examples. it's dead dude

See ?
You didn't even get the sarcasm. I feel sorry for you.

i'm sorry you're so delusional about the NA scene.

so you don't even know what sarcasm is? :(

xD

How do you determine that it's not your view that's delusional?

Either your trolling or daft. What part of, i've played...ok dude look i played 2.6 months of quake live. (hours time), played in tournaments, with and against clans and taken part in pickups. I have seen every facet quake live has to offer a north american player and i'm telling you now, it's non-existent in ql. You're simply a troll if you claim otherwise

now go make me a sammich bitch.

I'm just asking how do you know you are in right mind and that what you see is really what it objectively is, that your perception is not distorted?

You listed tournaments and ladders. That's quite different from dedicated leagues. How much money did fraggednation pay out every couple months? Was there a large opportunity to move up, or was it just a simple ladder?

I don't think you know what you are talking about to be honest, look at the games that are succeeding and see what they have that Quake doesn't, and it's dedicated leagues. I don't mean "tournaments and ladders"

fraggednation attempted na ladders
bibs attempted ctf tournaments for na players
quakeamerica tried the same
quadzero as well

He asked me to give him some kind of proof that the na scene is dying/dead. The activity in or around leagues/public servers on ql/tournaments has never been worse than this year. Its' at it's lowest point.

and i was replying him, so i don't know why i have to mention dedicated leagues to you since you're not even part of the conversation.

and lastly, you and the other 100 hardcore nerds that want to play in dedicated leagues aren't going to save the na playerbase. You're so wrapped up in the competitive aspect of ql that you can't see straight. That's part of syncerror's problem too. They only listen to guys like you. Newsflash dude, the competitive scene isn't priority right now, what's priority is converting the people who are left to paid subscriptions. All the tournaments in the world isn't going to make ql much money until people start purchasing premium/pro accounts. These developers don't work for free man.

This is exactly what's wrong with this game, all the priorities are completely out of whack. We're sitting here talking about how ql could succeed in na if they have some leagues. YOU NEED PLAYERS FIRST and they're not coming till there's some sort of integrated ladder on the quakelive.com website along with a stats system that works and moreover, they aren't coming till the cheating issues are adressed. Do you have any clue how bad that's getting at the moment? No, because you're busy playing your pickups in premium with your 3 clanmate friends and think everything is great. You're like crucci and tucker on the ql forum, completely oblivious to what's really happening to the majority of the playerbase.

It's the "whining, noob, leeches" that you all love to rag on, that are going to save this game. We need players right now, not more tournaments for the remaining diehards like yourself.

Seriously, even a caveman can figure this out. Oh and don't rebut me saying tournaments draw in players, YA THEY DRAW IN TIER 4 PLAYERS. New players can't even strafe yet. You expect them to be able to play in tournaments. So don't even try it.

Be realistic dude. If you come at me with this notion that you're above me then you better be prepared to deal with some facts. I played 8 hours a day for about 1 1/2 years and i know just about anyone who's anyone in the NA community. So for you to tell me i don't know if the scene is dying down when me and my clan made the only real integrated NA CTF leaderboard on our forum coupled with my statistics page that me and ra_ar were working on means that you're simply here just to troll me. So have fun with that. But i won't be replying back if you continue with your elitist attitude. It's that very attitude that has turned off thousands of "noobs" from this game. Guys like you treat new players like they're shit on a brick. It's downright shameful.

You are the most pessimistic person i've ever seen. I just started playing QL again and coming to esreality to listen to your complaining about the QL scene makes more people want to go away. Shut the fuck up.


ESEA will definitely help QL if they add it. If you think otherwise you definitely have a problem.

You're the most naive person i've ever seen. I was the most active NA player in NA period (was 3rd on time played on leaderboard) If you dont' want to believe what i'm telling you, then you're simply ignoring the truth. NA is dead in every way possible. Why pretend otherwise? What did you want to hear instead? yes, pour more time and money into the NA scene instead of on things that could actually save the genre at this point? NA is doomed. But you wouldn't know since you ....

I just started playing QL again

oh and

If you think otherwise you definitely have a problem.

that'll be a great tournament of 10 players ahhahahah. Guess you'll find out the hard way. There's a reason most NA leagues and tournaments don't exist anymore.

Yeah but its not because of ql, it has more to do with the fact that the average american has the attention span of a dead platypus.

You live in a nation filled with idiots, can't really blame them for doing what idiots do best, following the masses

did we bomb your country? so sorry

I'm not sure if you know what ESEA does, but they host leagues year round. There are usually 2 seasons a year, and depending on how you do the previous season you can move up.

In CS there is Open (everyone can play open)
then there is Intermediate (can only play Intermediate if you win some playoff games in open)
Then there is main (same thing as before, must win quite a few playoff games in intermediate to get to main)

Then there is Invite, which is the professional league.

People play all the time hoping to get better to move up. There is motivation to play, and they play year round. It's worked amazing for CS and if they can somehow get it to work with quake it will definitely help the quake scene a TON, and my guess is restore it quite a bit.

THERE ARE NO LADDERS. THERE IS NO MOTIVATION TO GET BETTER.....

Exactly. Glad you agree with me.

no shit. whether they were any good or not doesn't matter. Noone cared and there have been numerous admins at one point. I even campaigned for a spot for a while. There's just no NA scene man. It doesn't matter how well the ladder works, the players just aren't there.

And you must be joking if you consider those fraggednation ladders to be legit, they are the most poorly designed and run ladders I've ever seen, notihing compared to ESEA's services

As much of an idiot as ray is, he isn't a pessimist. In the past year, the game has lost 60% of its users, and that was without any major bad news. With even just the loss of ESWC and IEM, I'm sure it's going to be much worse over the next 12 months. If you think the addition of a single tournament or league is going to save QL, you're more delusional than ray.

What dedicated league does QL have right now?

Look at starcraft, they have an incentive to move up into different leagues. Same goes with counter strike, both are more active than QL. Hell, even Source is more active than QL. Players need an incentive to play, and a dedicated league where they can see themselves move up. People won't keep playing if all you have is a couple of random tournaments a year that are clearly going to be dominated by the best players. ESEA separates basically by skill level until you move up, and the incentive to play and improve is huge.


If there is a league like this for QL now that I am unaware of please let me know.

If you need an incentive to play a game, it isn't a game. People play SC2 because it's fun to play, not because they need "fun welfare". If you can't even get people to play the game just for fun, what is the point in trying to get them to play competitively? Very few people are joining QL with any interest in actual tournament play, and an extremely small fraction of those that do will even make it that far anyway.

I'm talking about an incentive competition wise. You don't think sc2 players are itching to get into platinum? Of course they are which is why they play their matches to advance. You have no such thing in quake. There is no room for advancement compared to other games.

If you can't even get people to play the game just for fun, what is the point in trying to get them to play competitively? - Vedic

this X 100000000000

i mean that just sums up everything that anyone has ever said about ql. gg

nothing more to see here folks the final nail has just been placed in the coffin

Yes, and competition is a SMALL part of the community. Very few people care about it, so it's not like it's going to bring back many (if any) players.

Even on ESR, plenty of people are interested in competition itself, but they're not interested in participating.

as much of an idiot as both of you are... lol..... (dont' take offense, just going with the flow).... vedic is right, one stupid league isn't going to do diddly squat to save the situation in NA.

QL in ESEA would help out the NA scene a lot. There really isn't a lot going on anymore here. Europe has leagues like CB and ESL, so they do alright.

Would be nice to see ESEA pick it up :)

organize one ?

the esl has always been a mess and cb litteraly is the shadow of what it used to be.

yeah cb isnt as glamorous as it used to be, but i still love what they are doing. 2-3 tournaments per year, several divisions. THATS what we need to keep quake alive, get lesser players involved in 'competitive' side of quake.

after reading about ESL dropping quake it really makes me wonder, everywhere people say how much they loved watching it and what a great esport it is, sadly it doesnt reflect in the numbers as much :/

then again ESL was just a front for quake anyway, no one got paid but atleast some games got played, but its nothing more than a charade

CB basically went south due to their own fault.

They had everything needed to be ESL and more, the top management just lacked the vision and i can know since i was one of the q3 headadmins along with HellSpawn and Right.

Tal did a great job making CB to what it once was but he did an equally great job in completely ruining it by failing to adjust to the times

I kind of knew that, but if you happen to have some links on some articles that elaborate all the nuances of this, please share

lpkane?? wtf?

this guy owns ESEA?

http://www.quakelive.com/#!profile/statistics/lpkane

Haha I never bothered looking for his QL account :P

I thought Torbull did unless he sold it?

They are both co-owners

Is lpkane the same kane who played for Team 3D several years ago?

Pretty sure it isn't the same one, I could be wrong though, I've only been playing CS about 2 and a half years now

No, that was Dave "kane" Cannon. He played for TAU, DoP and 3D.

lpkane was Team3D's webmaster and was co-owner of ESEA when it was just a lesson service for pros. They later added a premium public/pug service which is what built them to the level they are at today.

Ah thanks for the clarifying that.

I don't see why anyone would have a problem with ESEA adding Quake.

Why do people keep saying Quake is dying though? Just a year ago, streams only had about 1,000 viewers. This year, UGC had 3,000, Dreamhack got up to 5,000. 1 to 5 is a x5 increase. If we could continue at that rate, by next year we would have 25,000. A year after, 125,000. And that's despite the problems with QL, including the lack of intelligent development, marketing and key features. A game like LoL is new and popular now... 2 years it will be all but gone. Quake is one of the only games proven to stand the test of time.

Third-parties are only needed because first-parties have yet to do the work themselves. It doesn't really make any sense. If third-parties can profit through tournaments, why can't first? Blizzard, id and Valve could easily form a partnership to feature all three games. Not only can first-parties profit, they can profit more than third-parties. They sell their games, build better and longer-term relationships with sponsors, can invest more into the operation (as their sole-source of financial-backing does not come from personal investments or sponsors), and they can tailor their pro-games specifically for the purpose of increasing their profit-margins. As it is now, it seems their only reason for supporting third-party pro-gaming organizations is because they consider it free-advertising.

i agree, quake is actually growing atm, but stupid people can only directly compare viewer numbers between ql, sc2 and lol. this time last year quake had way less viewers than now, not to mention the growth of the tdm scene

Because they compare the numbers with other games.
btw. I'm not sure about 1000 viewers last year, was this ESL?

IEM Kiev cooller vs av3k finals had over 16k viewers alone on the english stream. i cant remember about the numbers on the russian stream

I keep wondering why doesn't anyone point it out that tdm finals vods have over 90.000 views - more than cs? Is it some kind of bug in justin tv? http://www.justin.tv/search?commit=Search&...amp;page=1

That's a good find, and LoL entered IEM cause they paid they way in.

Completely unverified claim by uhh slasher?

slasher has proven himself, he passed the ban test

Drop CS, bring in a bigger TDM alongside a bigger duel event, with a MASSIVE FFA to round it all off!

A good number of people prefer watching HLTV demos. I know I did.

1 to 5 is a x5 increase. If we could continue at that rate, by next year we would have 25,000. A year after, 125,000. And that's despite the problems with QL, including the lack of intelligent development, marketing and key features.

the last part of your sentence is why 125,000 won't be reached and really 125,000? with a playerbase around 25-40k? lolololol you're so out of touch it's unbelievable

oh and i'm not the most pessimistic, that's ketnar on the ql forums. i'm just realistic

I had an esea account for CS and their system was excellent. The way it's set up now it would only work with Q3 unless id helped (lol not happening) integrate with their client with QL.

That and both would be competing for roughly the same thing. ESEA is basically the cs equivalent of QL pro/prem... except for the whole tournament/ladder support with real bannings etc. :P

Yeah, I don't know how it would work out, but I do know that if they run the leagues for QL like they do CS then tons of people will have an incentive to play, like to get out of Open and into the higher tier leagues.

I hope it works out

Ya I really liked the ESEA system I just didn't play enough cs to justify renewing my subscription more than 2-3 times.

didn't ESEA try this with q4 and it failed horribly? I can't remember if this was during q4's peak time or not though, although I guess QL has always had a much larger playerbase than q4

nothing wrong with Q4 playerbase http://www.gametracker.com/search/q4/?sort=c_...order=DESC

if people ran q43a servers, there would at least be 200 players and no bots

what does that prove exactly?

everything. people on pub servers means a game has a life, some random people playing duels on some private listen servers mean nothing

3 to 5 servers in the entire game means it has life? ql probably has a couple hundred with people right now and I'd still say it's a 'dead' game

number of servers mean nothing if nobody is playing on them, they are just wasting bandwidth and nodoubt add upto 4000mb/h of international pipeline and satellite traffic

exactly my point, i was referring to the fact there are 3-5 q4 servers with people, while probably at least 100 ql servers with people on them at any given time

people on pub servers means a game has a life, some random people playing duels on some private listen servers mean nothing. - Port

this times x10000000000

some really good quotes in this thread. +'d

I'm glad no one plays quake4! (well here in Australia)
QL has brought heaps of people to quake that they would have never touched normally.

?

whole new game if you use Q43A yo, even on dedicated servers

if your gonna run a FFA pub server, enable the auto voice taunts on a frag for the phun casual players

no one plays quake4 or has it installed for that matter so why would anyone bother when quakelive has a lot of active players?

every forum says quakelive is dying, full of bugs, hated in general,

you all migrate to Q43A after some folks actually have had a game on a dedicated server

p0rt.. why not code your own game? quake 4 sucks and wont get popular, you can just create your own pseudo quake like warsow but good.

(warsow sucks)

And then if u implement the right newb features like tf2, steal some ladders from sc2 etc then have tiers reserved for actual skilled players where the skill lvl/combos/movement is as good as quake, you'll be successful.

But stop pushing ur q4 mod onto ppl, q4 sucks and is dead.

Dont feed the troll (p0rt)

Oh, he's a troll?
hrmm

Well more like spammer, spamming Q43A and what not.

he is like a troll... and also not a troll.

he spams random jibberish about his mod and modding in general when someone says "Q4" or "Quake 4" etc, sometimes coming off as a complete spam bot. On the other hand he really did code a mod (for trolling, who knows?) that nobody ever plays but he is dedicated like fuck to update it too.

all in all he is bizarre :)

Ah ok, it seems like he's beating on a dead horse though!

I can't see anyone even installing Quake 4 just to play Quake 3 when Quake Live is around. Seems like a weird meme instead of a mod.

I'm putting your Quake3 into your Quake4 so you can Quake3 when you have Quake Live.

Did I do that right?

Probably not.

check below for an example about him :D

its hardly spam when most things you all complain about in q3/QL/q4, i can say "thats recoded in q43a", you all say "q4 is shit" i say "most of the sdk is recoded"

none of you have actually worked any of it out, you all prefer to play q4max and gtr, cos i piss on your parade and enjoy it

not really, there is nothing much to put in Q4 that is Q3

gameplay is still what is an unmodded Q4,

the 3A in Q43A is more about :

a few tweaks on physics that make the gameplay feel more like Q3,
view frag leader/team base at end of games
full custom player models with sound sets
ambience, Q4 has none with all sound file volume and distance ranges all set to max, Q43A changes them all and adds abit more feels like Q3 after a while
strafe jumping/bunny hopping
full usable water if you make a map using func/func_liquid on map editor context menu [have to load Q43A and go into the editor to get the right def files]
some other random things


Q43A name, is better then militia which is what the mod used to be called, militia = total conversion, Q43A = Q4 gameplay mod

im not dedicated, it will remain at build #19.8 until after christmas or whenever, everything works in SP/MP/SEVERS on windows and linux, #19.8 got new menus, you all can configure it all, try it and find of tears to post

q4 is just q3 with new weapon models and set in some sci-fi enviroment

and modellers suck ass, along with the whole team modding thing, and there is no point in making a whole new game, just for the sake of new models and maps, there is enough new features in Q43A that makes Q4 a whole new game

Not every forum but if esreality is your only forum perhaps that's true. If we were to reverse the situation and quake4 was quake live there would be a hell of a lot more complaints about quake4 then there would be about quake live.

maybe and has been in q4 vanilla thread http://www.esreality.com/?a=post&id=1530058

but they are all fixed in Q43A, along with 100s of other small original game glitches and bugs and random game crashes

Q43A has all new netcode through out the whole sdk and so on, making online play all new and like nothing any of you have ever played with a game using idtech engine

most of the sdk has been recoded, there is nothing wrong with the engine, except for the renderer having low FPS if your using a PC from 7 years ago

Looks like its too much of a hassle, quake live is already centralised with an established player base. Quake 3 would essentially have the same problem. Can't compete against what quake live has to offer.

Quake4's biggest problem is that Quake 4 is forever etched into everyone's head as the worst Quake version released.

Q4 is like onion rings with salt n pepper on, Q43A brings the chicken and sour source

maybe some day ur mod will get popular. Just keep on trying to convience the whole quake community.
maybe I will try ur mod soon since ql is just boring... i really cant stand q3/ql anymore

it will rule the universe when and if Q4 engine is GPL`d, which could always be this quakecon, no other mod is worth playing, and all new ones that will be started will not recode most of the sdk, and i am not releasing the source of Q43A

This is now a p0rt thread

most people have me on their ignore list

i like your posts. Please tell me more about your q4 mod.

lol rayi is back, hooray.

lmao@being most logged in play in NA - want a fucking medal?

i wasn't bragging about it, believe me i wish i hadn't played all those games and done something more constructive, but the reason i mentioned it, was as counterproof to showcase that i know what's going on in the NA community, something he has no clue on, much like the devs themselves.

lol you would be the best self-hating jew.

QQ moar

i wish i hadn't played all those games and done something more constructive

Maybe someday you'll look back and realize the time you wasted posting for your crusade.

nah incubus, i won't regret that. I think you'll regret threatening me though