Crap I'm mentioned.

But I do understand why some duel maps aren't played, and that is mainly because they're, well... big. Which doesn't make good spectator material. Most of the unplayed maps were designed by people who mainly wanted to focus on casual gameplay anyway, it's possible they were never meant to be competitive at all.

I wouldn't say the reasons for that list of maps not being played is "obvious", though. To someone who has a basic understanding of balance but not the intricate details, they may think that you just need to keep the powerful items away from each other, keep the map a reasonable size, don't have lots of obstructions or annoying obstacles, and have lots of vertical action. Apparently it's not enough though, but those things are hardly obvious and need feedback from people who actually played around to notice. To me, "obvious" sounds like high expectations from the community to know what makes a good duel map. I didn't know most of that stuff back then and I doubt most other people would.

hide yarr kids hide yarr wives emeraldtiger is rapin everyone up in hea

I'm just defending the community. Not everyone is going to know why that list of maps up there isn't played.

There are more than enough competitive maps for all gametypes. Here's a list of all the maps played in duel tournaments so far:
- ztn
- t4
- t7
- t9
- hektik
- aero
- tox
- battleforged
- dm13
- dm6
- dismemberment
- almost lost (quakecon)
- trinity (quakecon)

im sorry but all of those are done to to death (or shit) and im not gonna play another duel until a new good map comes out

New maps are always welcome, I would love new maps.
Sadly 56+% of all logged duels are played on ztn at the moment. You can add a hundred new maps and people would still play ztn.

cpm3a has two yellows, a mega health, and a red armor :/
You sure you're not talking about cpm1a?

3a has a yellow next to lg, a yellow above lower rl/in front of rail, a red down next to plasma in front of the tp and mega in the little room upstairs next to the gl.

I might have mixed up the two, don't really know cpm maps that well.

cpm3a for pql, please.

I think concrete palace could be a decent duel map if it was tweaked just a bit.
As far as new maps for duel go, there are bst's, akm's and yellack's and mine (...and more). They just need to be added and tested.

Can someone tell me why sorrow, concrete palace and solid are terrible duel maps ? What are the criteria ?

What I don't like about sorrow is that the layout is some kind of U-shape (with the TP in the RL/YA room breaking it up a bit) - that's a major flow and show stopper for me and kinda ruins the map.
Concrete palace is actually a solid map IMO (pun intended) - the general layout is alright; just the areas holding the major items barely offer space for propper fights and don't allow for much variation. The map feels cramped overall and could profit from some upscaling. Also the layout could be changed here and there (i.e. remove jumppads; readjust the teleporter destinations etc.) to improve the flow and speed up the gameplay.
Solid, I haven't really tried in 1on1 since it was built for 2on2 tdm.

This guy knows his shit.
I liked your map that we've played on q3, it offered some really nice battles, it's just that I had no clue what's going on without a proper config and physics seemed off.

Bring that stuff to QL.

cmon, stop these silly topics...


theres like 10 maps you can play in duel [when u actually not playing against ztn only faggot that is], and noone needs more... mastering them should take 10k years

Can someone tell me if hektik and battleforged are worth learning? At the moment I want to practice furious heights, toxicity and lost world (never played it in q3), just wondering if I should add any to the list.

If you like fast maps like aero and toxic, hektik is quite nice (tho no one plays it anymore). It can be one sided very often + rail heavy map.

Battleforged I don't know. I guess it's so unpopular for some reason.

Good choice, my favorite maps :)
They give you a nice variety - each one represents different style.
Add me so we can play them. My ql nick is fautec.

No, I don't think so.

Hektik had it's moment and many top players disliked it.
I always thought Hektik could be the new fresh map in the official map pool - it was spectator friendly and offered some really exiting matches (namely, this).

It could turn out to be a very boring, rail heavy one sided map, but all maps can end up like this, so I'm not entirely sure why hektik was removed (apart from top players not liking it).

If I had to bet which one of the named maps (dm13, t7 and tox) would be out of the map pool first, I'd say tox.

edit: Hektik spawns could be really hectic at some points, lots of spawnkills and easy map control (hold RG/RA)

Here is amount of games you played on maps that "are not and will never be played for obvious reasons":

concrete palace - 4 games
devilish - 2 games
focal point - 5 games
gothic rage - never played
solid - never played
sorrow - 1 game

You know why we don't have new maps? Because most of the duel scene consists of self-proclaimed smart-asses like you who think they are absolute experts and can just look at map once and instantly judge it's playability.
The maps that feel like "horribly unplayable" at first are, in fact, best candidates for being a great addition to the map pool, because this "horrible unplayableness" means that your conventional game flow is not applicable for it and they might actually need some entirely original and fresh approach to dueling. I cannot possibly imagine, how you would assess playability of such map without playing at least 50 games on it.
You say you want something new, but then when you get a map where the tricks and patterns you learned on ztn or aerowalk don't get you anywhere, you just cry like a baby and designate it as a crap map after just a couple of games.
You don't want new maps. You want old maps with same 10 years old stale gameplay, that just have new looks. Please gtfo and stop ruining Quake.

The lack of new maps, specifically at top end tournaments, has stagnated the duel scene. Change the tournament maps and this will trickle down as people will play what the pros compete on.

New maps would hopefully mean new players reaching the top levels and competing. No more players who barely play quake anymore, but have played a map 30,000 times 5+ years ago coming back to compete.

New traps, moves and innovations would be found and saved for tournaments and this would make spectating even better.

I suppose this is out of our hands though.

Exactly my thinking.

The sad thing is that there are people from the community who have already built maps and sent them to id and they still cba to add them.

change hektik -> remove rail -> add nailgun -> increase bounce potential -> becomes REALLY HEKTIK.

battleforged -> remove RA -> add medkit (yes really) add YA -> becomes an actual battle not knowing who will win cuz of medkit help during insane fights

phrantic -> rocketlauncher - plasma - grenades - shotgun -machine gun, ONLY. don't need other guns to play this map.

solid/sorrow/concrete palace -> give to bst/cityy/yellack to fix

add the duel maps created by cityy/bst/yellack to win

c'mon fuck.

don't do drugs.

The maps that already in place could be changed. For example, ztn and dm13 could be upscaled a bit to compensate for the nuke rockets.

i like concrete palace and solid as duel maps. i wish people gave them more of a chance. same with battleforged. i don't get how people can give phrantic a chance, but not the other maps i mentioned. its weird. and with the new custom settings we can remove guns from the map.

The lack of map rotation in Quake in general (not just QL, all Quake games are guilty of stagnation in this regard) is quite shocking. Apparently once there is a solid set of maps everyone just shurgs and gives up on finding new ones.

The rationale behind it is that you need a lot of time to master a map and it's quite hard to make a map that is well balanced. My counter argument is that people are just scared to play on maps they do not know and map balance is not as big of an issue as it is in, say, SC2. As with most thing relating to balance there is a lot of overdramatization going on. Pretty sure that is one of the reasons why the very peak of QL competetive scene is so set in stone, too, it's usually the veterans who cry the hardest against losing the maps they played one billion years on. Of course new blood will have a hard time breaking through if they don't have all the angles and situations hardcoded in their brain from years upon years of grind and experience. Well, fuck that. That shit is hurting the game.

I thought with QL it's gonna be different, after the in and outs of maps like T7, T9, Hektik, BF, Toxicity. But it's too little and way too slow.

PIPE DREAM ALERT:
Ideally we'd want a completely different set of five maps every year, realistically maybe two or three swaps during the same time period so everyone can adjust gradually.

€: there are over two thousand maps uploaded to LvL. Of course, with the way QL works it's impossible for a wide range of players to test out anything new and potentially greenlight it as a replacement for the maps currently in use, but what are the odds there aren't at least several hundred that could either be perfectly playable from the get-go or after a few minor adjustments? Meh.

Whilst new maps make things interesting, I must say I don't get sick of maps like people are suggesting here. If ztn was never played again I would genuinely miss it. Same goes with japanese castles in ctf. I don't know if I haven't played the maps as much as you guys, or if it's just a difference in personality.

However, I suppose even if the official maps changed every year, it doesn't mean we can never play the old ones again for fun.

Totally missed this video btw. Hope it gets added soon
http://www.derquaker.com/sinister-yellack-ste...l-map-vor/

add some QuakeWorld, Quake 2 and CPMA maps and alot of players would be happy ( all new maps that they add are premium which make the map alot less popular,map list is full of some maps that you barely see someone playing it once in 3 monthes).

Which ones?

all of them :)

QW: dm2, 4 and 6. No idea if there are decent q3 conversions already made, but most probably yes.

Q2: dm1, hopefully the ospdm1 version for q3 as it is by far the best conversion ever made (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=59UQV7pDCAg 2:23). Chastity belt (ospdm8) could be quite nice, and it was used in the early q3 days.

Actually just add all the osp, threewave, ra3 and cpm maps. I know id won't be able to get some, as there are different authors in map packs, but just release all the "classic" maps (qw, q2, wcp17 etc.) present in them and that you already have the rights to do so.

Id will obviously not give everything away right now as they have to keep putting maps in their updates (4 a year), but ra3 alone has hundreds of arenas and they release 3 a year, and there are at least 3 highly requested wcp maps waiting to be released.

from qw,the duel maps that are currently in the tournaments' map-pool ( some were ported to xonotic and we still dont see any of them in ql).

from Quake 2 : q2dm1 ( they said the winter's version was not good for quake-live,so maybe they can add the q4 version which can be more good for ql), also, q2rdm2 AKA chastity belt duel ( there was a q3 version a little different from the q2 one but very good ,you can see czm vs fatal1ty playing in this map http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IYfGxBqInag ) that map can be awesume for duels,this is like a must for ql, also,why not q2dm3 and some other maps like ztn2dm3 AKA the rage)

from CPM i think some maps that alot of ppl used to play ( i didnt played q3 so i dont know much,ask the q3 players,they know more )

adding maps from previous quakes will increase the number of players in quake-live,ID still havent understood this ( they just add some not-worth-seeing maps and they are premium :/ ).

q2dm1, ztn2dm3