This has been discussed before.

There are people who claim it doesn't count as cheating, seeing where the opponent is in CA is trivial because the actions/positions switch so fast. It's actually not that easy to cheat that way because before you can type out or shout "the enemy is on pillars!", he's already rocketjumping away from that very spot, which may confuse the remaining player (given that this is a 1on1 situation).

Most players are aware of how much HP the opponent has, but some extra info like "railable/non railable" may be exploited.

I haven't really been paying attention to CA and its, hahahahah, competitive counterpart, but I thought this issue was addressed long time ago, where you pov after dying was locked on the remaining players who usually camped the hell out of the round, rendering CA even more boring.

In my opinion, no one except for the holy trinity of US retards care about public settings (coolout, ray and similar Einsteins) - so "ghosting" as you call it should remain enabled on those servers.

As for the compet-
ahhaa
sorry, as for the COMPETITI-
oh god I just can't do it.

AS FOR THE COMPETITIVE side of CA, there should be a cvar that locks your spectator pov on your team only.

The head admin, whoever that might be, is a giant douche for allowing this and claiming no one wrote the rule about ghosting.

I love your humour =) btw and I agree with your opinions. I guess CA is kind of the replacement for RA3 these days, so spec lock should be integrated into clan games just like in RA3.

ca will never be a replacement for ra3 without da queue

Hi? Please is to be providing evidence of claiming I'm a douche for saying "nobody ever wrote about the rule"?

Regards

I only heard his side of the story, did this really happen back in 2009?

if so, I have a complaint about gassing jews.

2010. The ghosting team lost the grand finals 3-0. In the end like I said it doesn't provide the same as a wall hack and knowing where your opponent is doesn't make it any easier to hit your shots. Watch the video I posted at the end of my reply if you care to find out more. I just came on to defend myself :-p

Or just remove CA altogether. Much easier.

stopped reading at “ca comps”… for a moment, and then continued for the potential of comedy value…

come on guys, remember back when ra3 was an accepted part of the community? surely it never had the respect of tdm, but it did have some merits and respect. Ra3 nations cups, clanbase ra3 eurocup etc.
CA is basically the same thing, but with less decent maps & worse cheat prevention (like ghosting)

remember back when ra3 was an accepted part of the community?

no, lol. though you did play an awful lot of ra3 :D

I don't

lolca

beat me to it :|

ra3 is cool ca is sad end of story

As organiser of this tournament

This happened in 2009 grand final I believe in which we recorded clan /x/ playing against clan x2. There was a huge discussion about it and to be consistent we decided to let ghosting go. In the end communicating a position is not the same as visibly seeing the player on your screen through a wall. And my team only really used it in the sense of putting off ventz and fraze by talking over the top of their sound. In b4 people say well in counterstrike its not allowed. Before we compare apples to oranges iD only added like 50 thousand server cvars a little while ago. I wonder why there is no force cam or fade to black in these settings.

Conclusion was its too hard to be consistent with enforcing the rule. You say watch the demos of the all players? In every game? On every map? When half probably don't record? Or have issues with recording? Will spectators also be enforced to hand over replays? What if teams aren't using public voice comms and are spec cheating? Where do you draw the line in the sand? If clan arena was supposed to be taken so seriously there would be server cvars set in place

fyi the ghosting team x lost to non ghosting team x2 3 maps to 0 aifink. Huge advantage ;-)

Well the conclusion is you obviously can't do shit about it but it would be nice if id software added the option to disable freecam for comp..com....compet COMPETITIVE CA

This thread^

I should get you to summarize all my posts. Want a part time.job ;-)?

2009? I didn't realise last night was 2009.

Oh yeah, I guess you did have this incident happen in 2009 as well. But I'm talking about the CA comp yesterday.

Oh and in yesterdays match the ghosting team won (by a couple of rounds, very close) which is entirely different, you could easily say that those few rounds easily were decided by the fact that they were cheating.

Not sure why this is so hard to understand, seems simple to me.

Obviously the 2009 example was a reference of the discussion to make it a rule. Not an example of how much of an advantage you gain from ghosting lol seriously thought you were a smarter man. Guess not

The issue here isnt determining whether or not ghosting is a form of cheating. The issue here is keeping consistency and control of a rule to enforce it in a competition. derp mzry not sure why this is so hard to understand, seems simple to me ;-)

No, actually you've been confusing a few people.
for instance:
comment 12 for Anhedonique - seems to be under the impression that this incident happened in 2009 now.
<Anhedonique> only heard his side of the story, did this really happen back in 2009?

Referring to a past incident where the outcome was not decided by this form of cheating, is you trying to justify what happened yesterday.
What happened yesterday is entirely relevant.

Basic example: when you have only 1 man left for the round, and he's carefully walking around the map to find the opponent, but the other team is ghosting him and gives away his position - this is a clear advantage to the cheating team.

I don't see why you cannot see this. Nice to see you lowering the quality of conversation by insulting me by the way, well done.

Nice to see you lowering the quality of conversation by insulting me by the way, well done

I agree, the insults weren’t required or even justified

Get angry son its the internet not a political debate. The example was portraying an instance of how this cheating doesn't necessarily.decide the outcome of a game. And youre still trying to prove that it does? When in actual fact the argument should only be about controlling this problem. Anything else you say is completely irrelevant... Yet you keep on addressing other issues rather then the only argument that can be made. I never said it was immoral all I'm saying is that by the rules its a fair strategy if both teams can do it, and until it can be policed consistently and effectively it will be allowed

Keep writing irrelevant shit tho I enjoy wasting my time

outside help is cheating of course

look ^
Someone with a brain, well done qstar =)

Thread conclusion:

Keep CA as is; bring back RA3 queue

'the thing is like, how can you define what is cheating and what is not, is it legal for you to tell your teammates when someone has been railed? is it legal for you to tell your teammates when someone is camping near a certain spot? i mean how would you do such a thing without the use of software outside of quake live? is it cheating for you to tell your teammate where a guy rj'd to after they killed you, which you saw from your dead body? or is that not allowed because you were dead? and therefore is that in itslef a form of ghosting? so the split second between dying and being alive to see that is the difference between being a cheater or not?

pretty ridiculous to define what is and isnt classed as 'cheating' really'

It's not ridiculous when it is blatant obvious in-your-face cheating. Like this for example camma.

thing i dont understand is how something that was not stated as against the rules can be labelled cheating?

if a man was charged with a crime and taken to caught for doing something many people defined as morally wrong, but there was no law against doing so, would he get in trouble? or be labelled a criminal in the eyes of the law? no.

So if aimbots aren't 'specified' in the rules, but the generic term 'cheating' is, then technically aimbots would be allowed aswell?

The concept is that ghosting is a universally recognised form of cheating, same as aimbots or wallhacks. This is why ghosting was not allowed in ra3.

In my honest opinion, doing anything that might be morally wrong to some people, however not stated in the rules, is not cheating. Sorry you don't agree with me mate ;D

ps, don't really think ra3 should be compared here, as that had the ability for free cam to be disabled, ofc i'd be in favour of free cam being diabled, or even if it wasnt, for a rule to be implemented and policed.

As it stands, there isn't one, and I think people who are calling it 'cheating' are incorrect, although i think i should note that i'm not condoning ghosting, or any form of 'cheating' for that matter.

Gets angry at me for referencing an event where ghosting team didn't win
Brings up a completely different game that had different server cvars
??????
Winning
- mzrys plan all along

ALL top CA players are using private hacks anyways, so ghosting makes absolutely no difference

YEA

first of all, lol ca

secondly, no idea why it hasn't been removed (not saying an option, I mean completely removed) of the game.

Honest question: why is CA not respected by the ESR community?

I respect CA, its not respected by elitist players, so they feel superior by bashing it.

Intelligent people value diversity, moreso when were talking about the #1 gamemode that can attract newbs to the game.

its a brainless mod aimed at beginners

after 10years of quake, i still don't really understand how competitive CA can actually work

its a fun mod aimed at those looking to have fun and frag shit - try going a few rounds with stermy, strenx or k1llsen on the server and tell me its only aimed at beginners.

But I agree about competitive CA... it just doesn't work.

Federer owns sub12 tennis players.

That doesn't make tennis a sport aimed at noobs though does it? I'm just saying that the three players mentioned above are known to be fond of playing alot of CA now and then and can hardly be considered beginners. Also players like v1um, I think moved from CA to top level TDM (he may correct me here if I'm wrong).

I'm just saying that playing against top CA players is very challenging indeed and if you want to develop inhuman aim and agression then its a great mod, but the mod itself is just for fun and is crippled competitive-wise.

CA. challenging and fun in the same sentence rofl.

CA is fucking boring! You die in a few secs 1v3 and then spend next 3 mins specing camping noobs. What a great action game! FFA is a number one choice for having fun mode.

it's not that interesting competitive wise

Until id adds the ability to fix this issue of ghosting, this thread is worthless

[+]'d and points to http://esreality.com/post/2314933/should-free...pid2315197

sync is the man :)

often the specs says totally bullshits just for trolling, example: SG! LG!!!!! to mean that the survivor is very low, and usually peoples dies rushing a stacked opponents with the sg from miles away.....
I've also seen the last two players stopping to write "stfu" to their legit temmates, thinking of jokes....

glhf!