inb4 w3sp cumback

what is it with you and w3sp

i knew this guy even when he was faking to a be girl on some forums and i forgot the name of...with all guys like bent and i duno. back then he was a really good strafer..nothing else. did he do something besides that? i stopped following at some point

Lets just say I am trolling, ok?

I will plus you only to calm you down

thx

i'm ''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''''' not ´ plz, hurts my eyes, inb4 ocd dude

?

' is not the same as ´ different key on your keyboard, plz use ' instead of ´. as ´ is something used on letters like é ā and so on, not a character on its own. im really anal here..

opc forums

overdrive pc

that´s it man :DD
is that still going on?

I saw it in 2010 for the last time. Now it's dead i believe.

http://www.esreality.com/post/1887658/w3sp-ca...rds-wiped/

ah, i understand alot of things now. even what belka_ wrote in some other post. cheers

Curious who you are, but anywho, before w3sp quit he had rank 1 on every map he had a time on, someone broke one of his times, he would break it back while you were asleep. It brought entertainment to DF :p
He also introduced GB to the community in a DFWC2008 map, everyone was like "WTF?", was quite funny.

i´m nobody man, proof is..i don´t even know what you mean by "GB".

care to educate me?

....something....bounce? haha..wild guess
no..wait...a bug..it´s a bug right?

cmon tell me

groundboost

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EQpnhTS4js&feature=relmfu

trickjumping

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7x66v9MaWso&feature=related

:DDDDDDDDDDD

damm, that looks so fucking good

cpma players are beats...

You would know, Nzr0.
GB Whore

what is this techically? don´t tell me it´s just simple plasma jumping

No, with a normal plasma hop you wont get speed, with a groundboost you will slide on the floor like it's a slick surface after you shoot the cell and then jump to get a huge increase in speed.

how does it work. cheat? only cpma? special angle? what

Only cpm movement pretty much, not sure if it can slightly work or not in vq3, but nobody uses it there. The angle can be looking straight down but it is recommended looking a little upper than that, more speed gained i guess or easier.

dude, what's with the ´ ? why oh why

so, basically, the logic is: "doesn't matter if someone cheats, if he brings records and excitement" ; under this aspect, well, e-"sports" (lol) are not that different from real sports...

Since when in either of these comments did a cheating "logic" come to play? Nobody mentioned anything about cheating, but since we are on the topic, he got banned without any conclusive proofs, the reason he got banned was for +left from a demo in the database that was made before the rule of +left was even announced. HK also accused him of mousewheeling the mccormic_mark demo even though it was a simple double jump. So really there was no cheating involved in any of the demos he got banned for. But whatever eh, fuck "logic".

How can you get accused of binding a key rofl. Great idea btw, like mousewheeling in cod to shoot faster.

the concept is "doesn't matter what he did (cheating, what else?), he brought a lot of entertainment" , this is the same reasonining that peoples uses with strenx and others players

And again, where was the mention of "what he did", I didn't mention one word about cheating or anything, I didn't even hint towards what he supposedly did, I said what was fun when he played the game, not one word about cheating or anything else in that subject.
Do you even know what happened really, do you even play Defrag or are you just some guy who just reads the forum and has no clue what they are really talking about e.g. AL|EN.

And still, not talking about anything to do with cheating of any kind by w3sp, lols

"o you even know what happened really, do you even play Defrag or are you just some guy who just reads the forum and has no clue what they are really talking about e.g. AL|EN."

What about you? Your opinions seems really biased; aniway, if you would be a quaker, you would know by yourself that some of the moves he did are just impossible; but the biggest confirm to the cheating statement is already W3sp's reactions to the question

Biased? My opinion is "biased" because the "Proof" that got him banned was NOT proof.
And yes, I play Quake, Defrag too and the moves he does are far from impossible(Practice, Practice, Practice (c) Fatal1ty) ;)
And, w3sp's reaction, what reaction? Him and the admin(hk) have had their differences for years before, hk was always trying to find something to get him banned for.

orly? Seriously, then, why do you think he ever refuse to provide his "feel outro" freestyle demos, even if he was continuously asked about it?

Link please, hes shown that to Bazz and I before on stream, he has offered the demo to us before too.
He doesn't need to give out demos on request so why would he?

because he was requested to provide demos to demostrate his innocence; if he would be innocent and proud of his runs, why shouldn't he ( she x.x) spread them wide and fast?

Nobody NEEDS to give anyone demos, its their own choice, he's no different to anyone else. You don't even need the demo, watch the movie outro instead, it looks much better than a demo

lmao are you retarded or what? you NEED to give a demo, if requested and under acccusation of cheats, and you are GLAD to give away demos if you are innocent and proud; also, every noob knows that a match looks 100x times better on a demo than on a stupid film... 120hz, HD resolution, stereo sound...... and PROOFS OF CHEATS.

http://www.q3df.org/news/52

Noone can proof anything at this level of cheating. The only way to proof something is seeing with own eyes.

words of the admin who banned him

ok, i didn't know it, even if not only in defrag some cheats are not recognizable; but still, or even more, is suspicious that he didn't provide demos, when he should have had all of the reasons to do so, if clean; not to mention that he (she) also did videos in which he played the piano, so why not did the same with the defrag runs, to clean all the suspects..

The outro demo wasn't even important to anyone, he didn't NEED to give it to anyone, it wasn't a record. The actual runs in the movie were given out in a pack, the outro has no importance to anyone EVEN if it was cheated its a freestyle and doesnt mean anything. ZzZz.

that doesn't change the fact that he cheated and acted fishy

As said below.

...As said below.

If sombra posted a video playing without a wallhack right now would you believe he did not cheat in that cup where he sent his radar screens? The burden of proof is on the accuser because unless you have every single one of your games recorded you can't prove you never cheated.

Read all that in 5 seconds. Seems like there are server demos of him using multiple scripts in his records (not just +left/yawspeed but faster on stairs and others), so why are you all discussing if he cheated or not?
cgaz said w3sp cheated constantly too, not just some admin with a grudge.

Also not providing demos is always fishy. For example how come does he not uploaded the castle run demo in all these years (among others), or a video of himself playing.

edit: defrag is so weird

Maybe take more than five seconds to read it then? Admin says there's something fishy about w3sp skimming some stairs and arcaon, kiddy and others tell him there's nothing fishy about it.

If you read it all you would have noticed I said how can we take the word of some guy saying cgaz said something in broken English? And I also said above, there is no need to provide the outro demo since it isn't a record, the actual records were in a pack.

doens't matter if it is freestyle or not, it is cheated but presented like if it wasn't

You have zero proof that it's cheated :)

and you have zero proofs that it's not :)

while a lot of runs, and the general behavior of w3sp are highly suspicious

Okay then, so we could both be wrong and we will never find out anyways, digging up the past for nothing.

or you could be more probably wrong, considering the various aspects, but we still never know, because w3sp will always refuse to provide his (her) demos, even if they could also not be enough to proof something; and to w3sp this is not "for nothing", it more seems to be the reason of a living

He doesn't provide his demos because he doesn't need to, all of his online records were in the demo database, hk had them all.

he does; and he didn't; and he acted fishy; to consider him(her) innocent is not even naive, but just blatantly biased

He doesn't need to provide his demos, especially not a freestyle demo, he provided the rest of the movies demos :)
Also, please don't be hypocritical, you're being blatantly biased towards the fact that you think he does cheat yet have no proof.
I think you are unaware too that it isn't really that important in defrag if you are suspected of cheating, you won't get banned from servers, you just get your account removed and times removed from the rankings, you can create a new account straight away so it really isn't that important :)

I'm not biased, since a lot of peoples claims that he cheated, and he always acted in a suspect way; to not provide demos even after heavy request is like to admit to having done something that shouldn't have been done, while to the contrary you should just be proud to spread them around;
also, to say that in freestyle doesn't matter if someone cheats or not is pure madness;
And to cheat in freestyle is exactly, like to use aimbots, wallhacks, timescale etc. versus a bot, and then making a fragmovie about it, writing in the description "watch how good am i in dueling";
Your last statement, finally, simply doesn't even makes sense

The last one doesn't make sense to you because you have no clue abut Defrag.
I'm done with this "argument", it's a complete waste of time, the only things you think you know are from the forums and not from actual Defrag experience, he provided important demos and that's all he needed to do, only you care about the freestyle demo and nobody is going to care if it is cheated or not. It's amazing regardless even if it is timescaled.

In the future I recommend you don't listen to ZERG and AL|EN's retarded "cheater lamer" comments :)

The last one doesn't makes sense at all, because you think that as long one provides excitement etc, he can cheat however he want, and mostly create film arguing that are not cheated and acting childish whenever asked about it, confirming all the suspects;
also "even if it is timescaled is still amazing " is an example of how inconsistent are your try to defend her;
"nobody cares abot it" is clearly false; since nobody cares about w3sp and his sexual disorders because he cheated, proved or not doesn't matter anymore;
the only ones who thinks he is legit and a great person are the newbies that sees his youtube videos and have not clue in how many ways there are to cheat in defrag;

Last but not least, the persons you recommand to don't listen are actually a lot more reliable and coherent that you, so your advice may more easily be read as "in the future i recommend you don't listen to lithxiv and w3sp's retarded "proof me i cheated or i didn't" comments

You've obviously read too many of AL|EN and ZERG's whine comments without proof :-)
You never even answered my question, "do you even play defrag?". You talk like you know alot about defrag, but all you seem to know about it is the forum posts you read.
You also talk like he's a he/she, but it's quite obvious he is male, check his videos for proof @ Gamescom, and the fact that you keep even mentioning "she" is because you are quite obviously one of the butthurts about the pwnage he gave you all when he renamed :-)

"Do you even play defrag?"

Like if playing defrag would have anything correlated with w3sp being a cheater;
to the contrary, the fact that you expose so much the fact that you play defrag shows only that your opinion are biased in the (useless) attempt of making defrag and defrag community seems better than it is (and that obviously don't meaning that defrag is good or bad, there are cheaters in every single videogame, and always will);

about the he/she question: you continuously argue about your aknowledge about anything related to defrag, but, like often happens, you are just owning yourself: in that case, you don't even know that w3sp acted and pretended to be a female, until his real sexuality have been confirmed; and this is just another, but greatly meaningful, sign of how little equilibrate w3sp personality's is;

Lastly , basing on the incoherence and the inconsistence of your denials about w3sp cheating and cheating in general, and mostly on your exaggerated and arrogant statements, the only one butthurt, here, seems to be you.

p.s. edited

What do you call it when someone misspells words he hopes would make him look smarter? Irony. Equilibrate is a verb and it's spelled inconsistency. Stick to easier words, your posts are hard to read as it is.

i understand what you mean, i just realized it by myself various times.... the problem is that i reasons following my own language grammatical rules, and the english writing is just a "conversion" of that ; plus the result is complicated even more by the strain in reminding english words and grammar rules, and often additional by some words and phrases traductions by Google Translator :-/
I find really difficulty to express complex concepts in english, i apologize if my externations are not comfortable to understand. sometimes that even generates incomprehensions and unwanted hostile reactions;
I may add that often i cannot (can't, lol) understand plenty the word tricks and the deep reasonings posted in sites like esr; it's easier to understand the english wikipedia, or other forums and blogs.

you are just owning yourself: in that case, you don't even know that w3sp acted and pretended to be a female, until his real sexuality have been confirmed
Sure I know, but I'm not the one calling him a "she" in every sentence even though they actually know his real gender, the only thing you know about this is what you have read from the forums which is pretty pathetic considering you are trying to argue about it without any actual experience.

I also think that you don't understand, you are basing your own argument on the fact that he cheated 100% without proof and are the one saying that I have owned myself(lol).

Also, I have no reason to be butthurt, I'm not the one he owned under a fake nick and still whine about it to this day, people were just too retarded to realise it was actually him playing the piano in the video and not the girl :-)

Oops almost forgot, do you even play Defrag and under what nick if you did? Stop dodging the question, thanks.

A lot of your statements doesn't even makes sense.... like the whole question about he/she, that isn't difficult to interpretate;
About the cheating, the very same can be said to you, considering that you pretend that he didn't cheat at 100%, while you don't have proofs (and the proofs may not even be accurate in accusing or not him); while the fact that he (she ) acted fishy is undeniable and stays, in spite of what you might say.
"Also, I have no reason to be butthurt, I'm not the one he owned under a fake nick and still whine about it to this day, people were just too retarded to realise it was actually him playing the piano in the video and not the girl :-)"
Here, is not clear to who you are referring, but it's pretty clear that the fact that someone legitimately doubts about your defrag hero seems to hurt you, and that also is suspect when you try to defend him against even the easiest logical contraddictions.
Oops almost forgot, do you even play QW and under what nick if you did?

I don't play QW, it also has no relevence to this conversation :)
Referring to the butthurt newbz who whine about the fact he fakenicked as a female to this day, and the fact that you can't even refer to him as male (there is enough proof that he is infact a male) just proves that you are indeed butthurt as well.

lmao, you serious? You really think that someone could doubt about him being a male or a female? What's your age? Because you don't seems to really understand various things, but you carefully avoid to answer to uncomfortable things;
It's pretty clear that the fact that someone legitimately doubts about your defrag hero seems to hurt you, and that also is suspect when you try to defend him against even the easiest logical contraddictions.

w3sp is male and w3sp doesn't cheat. HRHR Thanks for listening. Now fuck off and stop replying to me, there isn't any proof nor will there ever be.

w3sp is male, and everyone always knew it, but he apparently didn't like that fact, and acted in an ambiguous way even under that aspect;
Moreover, he cheated, with all the probabilities, but he will ever refuse to provide his own demos, with an excuse or with another one; because that would provide the proofs of his cheating;
Now, fuck off ans stop replying to me, nobody listened to what you say.

You obviously listened to me, you butthurt little mong. w3sp doesn't cheat. umad? )))

I don't listen to what you say, since you are a known cheater trying to defend another known cheater, using ridicolous and illogical excuses, you butthurt little mong.
W3sp cheats, so do you. umad? (((

w3sp doesn't cheat in defrag, nor do I, child.

w3sp cheated immensely in defrag, like others peoples did, like you did.

Now you are saying I cheat at Defrag?! Give me real proofs. Also, w3sp didn't cheat.

I'm just saying you are a cheater, and you know this; also, w3sp did cheat.

Maybe I did cheat, but not at Defrag. You have no proof w3sp cheated anywhere.

You cannot even proof w3sp's innocence, anyway... and there are so many clues to sospect, that it's way more difficult to seriously think he's clear; more like almost impossible.

You don't even play Defrag, you don't know anything about the mod. You go on what other people say, you won't ever prove if he cheats or not yourself because you don't even know what you're talking about or looking for.

How do you know i don't even play DeFrag? Or that i don't know about the mod... If i knew nothing i would have said that w3sp is an hero, a superhuman, and maybe a beatiful girl! For sure that he didn't cheat.... how is it even possible, to cheat in defrag? You can't use an aimbot, or the other thing, how is it called, you know, the thing to watch behind walls.... it is not even possible to cheat in quake live!
No, no, wesps did not cheat, she is just a very skilled girl... i wish i could be her, maybe when my parents will gift me the <3 Razer Mamba...!!

Very good, you've just listed everything that was written on the forums! It's pretty obvious from the way you speak that you don't play Defrag, well done.

The obvious thing is that you are a cheater and that's the reason you desperatly defend the cheater w3sp.

Okay, proof at cheats at Defrag please )))

what is the question? write it down in an understandable form

There is no question because you cannot provide an answer, there's no proof, cya.

A cheater admitting he cheated, and defending an even more blatant cheater... asking for proofs they refuse to give.

No proof, cya.

Not needed, you both stay notorious cheaters, cya.

I played Defrag since old OPC and have spoken with Camping Gaz in real life about w3sp cheats (not some random IRC chat) with positive answer from his side. Did you ? If there i only person who has clue what he really talking about, it's me.

Okay, and you also mentioned that he "cheated" in Freestyle right? Not online records or something, I have used some form of cheats without logging in records, it really has no effect on anyone :)
If w3sp used them in freestyle like you say, then he is infact innocent, just because you or someone else thiks his times are too good it doesn't mean he is a cheater.

Also, just because he has access to cheats does not make him a cheater in defrag :s

If w3sp used them in freestyle like you say

When and where i say that ? I only mention that Camping Gaz refuse to check w3sp freestyle demos because "in freestyle you can use any cheat as you want" with is ofc total bullshit. Does DFWC03 is freestyle ? Does DFWC04 is freestyle ? But for people like you nothing will be enough.

So for you, if someone use undetected reply scripts, demos cutting , post a movie and claims that it was done by hand, it's not cheating right ? It's you and people like you low standards ! Back to OPC times, everything was clear: no any form of cheats, no matter if it was freestyle or not !

just because you or someone else thiks his times are too good it doesn't mean he is a cheater.

When you out of arguments you came with "he is better so he must use cheats" Explain why people like ZyaX/Roody/glm was never accused for cheating ? Because they play fair even if the know all of those hacks/tricks/other crap. That is admirable attitude, nothing else.

Nope, not DFWC04 or DFWC03, I remember you saying that he cheated in freestyle which wouldn't really matter.

So for you, if someone use undetected reply scripts, demos cutting , post a movie and claims that it was done by hand, it's not cheating right ?

Alot of his times in the movie were done online and recorded, if they were cheated. he would have already been banned at the time the movie was released, so no they aren't cheated to me :)

glm/ZyaX/Rody were not accused of cheats because they did not have rank 1 on every map, that is the only reason he was accused of cheating.

It's you and people like you low standards ! Back to OPC times, everything was clear: no any form of cheats, no matter if it was freestyle or not !

Lols, like it matters if someone cheats in freestyle or online without logging, it has no effect on anyone what so ever, it doesn't harm anyone or their times.

He is innocent until his online records are proven guilty, and the "proof" that hk provided is not proof, many people used the +left and mousewheel commands already, but he only got banned because of the grudge he had on him :)

Speak more later, at college now so I couldn't pick up on everything you said. Latersz]

edit: i failed on the quotations, so meh.

Nope, not DFWC04 or DFWC03, I remember you saying that he cheated in freestyle which wouldn't really matter.

That is simply not true. Look at the mDd boards. If you continue to bring up this bullshit i will assume that you just wanted to hear this. I never actual care about "freestyle" but Defrag World Cup is a different thing.

But let's leave this. How about: "This demo(DFWC04-1) is cheated, i will told him to not do this cheats again because he might be caught." @ Camping Gaz. Note that i wasn't +left as CGaz don't care about +left. Still no cheater in you eyes...really ?

There are many people who use +left and mousewheel commands and they all are worthless cheaters. And many of them was banned also. The only grudge what i see is that many, many people suspect him for dirty tricks since OPC times, and they was right. But again, for you no matter of evidence will be enough. You and others will simply say: "So what that he use scripts from time to time? He can play without them !". It's simply pathetic ...

Hold on, we can't go on what you say that CGaz said in real life, you are kind of a delusional guy anyways, but there would actually be no proof of him saying that, also, I am pretty sure you said on IRC in #defrag the other day that the demo Gaz saw was just freestyle.

+left and mousewheel are really not cheats, they are default keys in the game, bound to keys, if many people used them, then they must be all cheaters too and ALOT of people used them even your beloved glm, rody and zyax i presume. The replay script accusation has never been proven and won't be, so there is really no evidence of him actually cheating.

You could always tell CGaz to pm me and prove what you are writing.

I will add, the only demo I have ever thought was "cheated"(timescaled) was his f33l freestyle outro and I could be wrong, but that really doesn't matter either since it's a freestyle demo, are you going to ban his online records for cheating in a freestyle? Nope.

Hold on, we can't go on what you say that CGaz said in real life, you are kind of a delusional guy anyways, but there would actually be no proof of him saying that

The only delusional guy i see is you trying to not facing facts. You assume that what i say is all lies and conspiracy made by me because for some reason i don't like w3sp. Get real man. I assumed that all of his demos was ok and people will finally shut up until suddenly this came up.

I am pretty sure you said on IRC in #defrag the other day that the demo Gaz saw was just freestyle.

Not true and you still ignore what i wrote here and at mDd.

+left and mousewheel are really not cheats, they are default keys in the game, bound to keys,

Again, weak and pathetic excuse. You can bind "run my nice script" to ! There are cheats by any means because mousewhell makes you can double jump easy and +left is jus moving the mouse by mathematics algorithm of time*cl_yawspeed formula, allowing for perfect mathematical turns! For every people with IQ more than 85 is clearly a cheat in Defrag game.

You can only say that it's not matter for you.

Get real man? What I say is true, how does anyone know that what you are saying is true other than gaz if it is true, they do not. As said about hk with the grudge, you also have the same one on w3sp and would do anything to try and get him banned :-)

So, if someone uses +left and binds jump to mousewheel in a baseq3 game, say tdm. They are cheating? :)
I don't think so, they are just using default key bindings, so nope it definitely isn't a "weak and pathetic excuse", you can go on and on over the same facts, they will never change.

Get real man? What I say is true, how does anyone know that what you are saying is true other than gaz if it is true, they do not

Because people know me and know that I'm honest person. Too bad that i didin't put some hidden camera. Yet, I beat that if you would see a movie from my room will all of what i'm sayin, you would say "it's acting ! And if not, it's a clone of CGaz like "Judge Dreed" xD

So, if someone uses +left and binds jump to mousewheel in a baseq3 game, say tdm. They are cheating? :)
I don't think so, they are just using default key bindings, so nope it definitely isn't a "weak and pathetic excuse", you can go on and on over the same facts, they will never change

We play Defrag game, not Quake 3 "shooting to opponents and timing quad". Comparing "quake 3 FFA/CA/TDM/CTF/Duel things and default quake3 binds to Defrag is ridiculous. Same story with g_synhronusclients 0 and you will always loose going that way.

If you have an auto-timer that shows you when the next MEGA will be available, it's cheat in "Quake 3 Duel" but has nothing to do in "Defrag" game. Its exactly opposite. I'm sorry for you that you don't see it.

I'm finish with you, I have a demo to record. And find some "random OB i think"

EDIT: Those kind of people defending w3sp: http://www.quakelive.com/forum/showthread.php...post242153

so how can you abuse mousewheel?

Would jump continuously up a set of stairs without stopping, vq3 and cpm. I'll show you a video which cgaz botted which pretty much gives the same kind of indication.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=084SslHAoPI

Starts at 0:25

Don't be fooled by all those "w3sp is innocent !" bullshit. I was always amazed that there are some people who know what he did and still threat it like nothing really happen. He use cheat at DFWC03 (self admitted) and long before it, he use cheat at DFWC04 (Camping Gaz proved it at my house when he analyze his DFWC04-1 demo, quote by him "This demo is cheated, i will told him to not do this cheats again because he might be caught."), he "magically" stopped playing when online servers got "server demos" to find any cheats that he use and he always use every dirty trick that he could find to "entertain" all Defrag community. But hey ! Still, everything is ok for some people...

I spoke to cgaz' mother and she told me he's a pathological liar and on medication for it.

Now how can you believe what I just wrote? Get gaz to tell us himself or just stop it with the hearsay!

And if he cheated so much and he did perfect runs yadda-yadda, why is it when I check !oldtop on any map it's always slower? Does that mean anyone who beat him is a cheater too?

Lolz, nzr0!

The fact that his records was beaten means nothing. If someone use wallhack and loose, he is a cheater or not ?

It would mean nothing if he wasn't the only one banned and him being too good wasn't one of the arguments for him cheating.

don't worry, i'm not that naive like all the peoples wathcing the "building magaobject" movies in minecraft and thinks that all the amazing things they see are really built brick by brick, manually (lol!)

Even if i'm not into the defrag community, or much aknowledged about it, i have enough critical sense to smell that W3sp is not clear, and doesn't acted like if he (she :-X ) was;

thanks for your effort in trying to discriminate what is correct and right from what is not, regardless of how many dirties are against you; keep on!

Just to bring up some light at the end: those kind of people defending w3sp: http://www.quakelive.com/forum/showthread.php...post242153

;-]

:-) $$$$

he's busy playing piano for LoL audience http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hwLDU-N_7o&am...rofilepage

lol?

That's a group he fits in with.

LoL

"he is an amazing, amazing penis."

edit: i can't possibly have been the only one who heard this

Progressive trickjumping by Japex

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MD_uqyhwVt0

The first defrag video I ever watched.

FUCKING BALLER

is there a problem with wmo provided by amazon.com?

No, not at all.

sooo... does this mean it will have more of a fun cpm like movement system?: )

My panis is in neutral.

What about requirements? Will it run on an kinda old pc like ql/q3 does?

The problem with this particular " kinda old " is that most people mean "my single core opteron".

TBH I don't even know parameters of that pc... :d It's the one I'm using only to play ql on it. ;)

playable beta will be in 2 years, so you will have new pc.

I don't know for sure but I'd not bet on it.

Sort of anti-climatic. The same update as last time, basically - "we might have funding, can't say much". More waiting...

if they went kickstarter I'd back them...

O M F G !!

what?

OCH MY FUCKING GOOOOOOOOOOODDDDDDDDDDD

Someone is talking about "We care about Trickjumping community" :O

I didn't read a thing but I want the demo of the castle run in f33l

Watching the w3sp defrag non-sense in this thread blow up after so many years, I only have one thing to say.

This is why defraggers can't have nice things.

just like in the old times on opc

insane... defragers are more skilled then duelers I am sure... so pefect.. how much tryes you need to do single map so perfect? 500?1000?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QshC0D2ms4&feature=relmfu
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C0Voq1ncW1I

if you want to be the best at duel, it takes just as much skill as if you wanted to be the best at defrag.

why ppl use such annoying models? aaaaaaaaaaaaarrrrrrrrr my ears :<

That's cool but how many times do you have to play a duel map if you want it to be perfect and beat the best?

every defragger i played with was stone stupid and had shit aim. but yeah the stuff they pull is insane. and also yes, i cant even make past the basic strafejump practice map but who cares.... it is like 2 completely different game, just the same engine.

watch siglemics sm64 speedruns. guys been at the game for over 2 years, holding 2x world records in 70 and 120 stars. truly godlike stuff

except that duelers adapt their skills depending of the situation given and defraggers use their skills to perform the same run over and over again till it's perfect... you are watching single recorded runs that i assume are the best ones for those maps... not like i don't enjoy this, i watch mrhollydriv3r's videos like twice everyday

And in duel there is no such thing as a perfect game. Quite poetic compared to perfecting a race. Defrag is basically like playing DDR^3, and please don't get me wrong, they are very skilled but the two simply cannot be compared imo.

so did w3sp cheat or not

?

)

He did cheat but no one could prove it so he totally did not cheat because it was only used in a movie and he didn't cheat because he didn't get the world record but no one could prove it so I guess after all he didn't cheat at all except when he used cheat that no one could prove he used so he probably didn't cheat despite some demos that he didn't want to release because he obviously cheated but those who saw the demos claim there was no cheating involved and he just hanged out with some cheaters but he didn't cheat himself because no one could prove that he didn't cheat so he maybe cheated and now he's not cheating anymore because he's playing piano and doesn't have time to not cheat in a game based on cheating but not everyone cheats.

wow could very well be the longest sentence ever!
so much cheating in your comment its funny!

The game is going to have poor-mans version of strafe/bunny (2GD said so). Im sure defraging will be so fun.

Link please

It's said on that long ass video by 2GD where he announces the game.

It's going to be a disgrace.

if you want QW go play QW. One of the reasons why it has 5 players is its movement.

I don't care about quantity. Justin Bieber has an insane amount of listeners and it sucks.

If the game is a "success" but it has shitty movement it would be as if SM was a huge success. No one that knows about quality would give a fuck and they would still play Quake.

True dat. QW movement is tiresome and boring.

Noob

Fanboy

Idiot

5 at 3 in the morning is more than ql at fucking 11pm.

This + better netcode.....

If under "poor man" you meant "simplified" than this is the great news.

I, for example, really liked very simple, but very fun bunny hopping/air control/ramp jumping implemented in Xonotics.

Terrible game.

Doesn't matter - they implemented movement system in a fun way. You don't have to learn it a year in order to be able to move fast through the map.

It wasn't fun.

Glad that you won't play Reborn then. It doesn't need players with such narrow-minded attitude as you. :)

I will play it if the movement doesn't suck ass.

I thought you already knew the movement will suck ass.

It will, i just have the naive hope it doesnt.

You are not very consistent.

unlike modern fps games, who are consistently shit

Xonotic movement is awful.

as long as there's some kind of movement im glad, what im more worried about though, is the time it takes to swtich weapon. oh please 2gd, fast switch. just, fast switch.
cpm/qw/wsw/pk style pl0x kthxbye

immediate weapon switch removes depth to the game

no it doesn't :)

yes it does)))

Depends on map design and movement speed. Fast switch makes melee fights more based on who gets first shot and who picks better weapons to subsequent shots, but there is really not much difference at longer distance (since rail is invariably the best weapon at distance). Being out of position can be punished more by map design than just by having wrong weapon out when turning a corner.

Personally, I think fast weapon switch requires more vertical maps for 1v1 (it punishes out-of-position play more than "flat" maps). For TDM, it's a bit different since map control is based more on item control and teamwork.

Long weapon switch time means having the right gun at all times matters a lot, have a bad pick and you are dead no matter what you do, therefore it adds a layer of complexity that QL does not have or at least isn't crucial.

Same can be said about way too fast movement speed with people jumping all over the place. If the game is slower -more like without players jump strafing at 300km/h- then positioning, info of the opponent and mind games matter a lot more on a duel game.

It's not like I made those arguments up. I just stole them from purri and thresh respectively, and I'm not sure I would want to see those 2 aspects on reborn if they want it to be successful since those 2 concepts are long forgotten (vanilla q2 and q1 respectively).
They should be considered though since fazz once said he dislikes that aim and movement matter too much on QL therefore the "chess" part of it gets lessened with each release. Have you noticed that q1 (not qw) was more strategic than q2, that q2 was more strategic than q3 (sound plays a huge part there too), q3 more than q4 and then QL is sort of in the middle of q3 and q4?

Then why don't we play Goldeneye on N64? Weapon switch is very slow and movement is even slower.

The reason why we play quake and not other games is because the game is fast and exciting, not because it's a chess alternative. Sure, there is depth in vq3 due to weapon switch and limited movement, but that's not ONLY what makes the game deep (I think the weapon types/effects, movement, armors, and good maps make it good as well). Vq3 can be a boring/shallow game on the wrong maps. Same is true for QW or CPM. But depth of game is possible with fast weapon switch and fast movement but it requires that map design exaggerates positioning more and does not allow a player to constantly run away.

Instead of reducing the movement speed in QL (I think QL shouldn't just be a duplicate of vq3), there needs to be more maps that play better with the chain-jumping. I think Hektik does that fairly well. The map is fast but you cannot run away all game. Some people hate the map, but I think it requires more time to mature.

goldeneye is 1000000000000000000000000000000x more popular than quake will ever be, and people venerate it as one of the very best games of all time even with its slow weapon switch and speed. It doesn't necessarily have to be cpm or qw fast to be considered good.
Want more examples? halo4 and cod bo2....

Obviously there are more factors, but you have to admit that with slow weapon switch and especially reduced movement (more like slow) add depth to the game since decisions and positioning matter more as they can't be solved mid-fight by changing weapon in 0.00001ms and walljumping away.

Those are a gameplay choice, but I'm saying cpm/qw are a rarity played by 5 players whereas the masses actually like what I said and take it for granted, and then there's fazz's opinions (someone that works on reborn, which is what we are discussing) who says he personally wants more strategic play on the next arena fps instead of jumping with aircontrol all over the place.

Gotta agree with megaman, I think the whole idea of making the right gun choices is just another avenue of skill and strategy. You pay for it if you use a railgun up close, for example.

I really don't have an issue with QL's weapon switch speed, but I wouldn't say no to faster either. I'm not really a fan of insta-switch.

Slow weapon switch is not the primary reason why there is skill/strategy in Quake.... Most of it comes from the movement, items (armors/megahealth), and the effects of weapons (hitscan vs. non-hitscan, firing rates and damages, projectile behavior, etc.). Quake is a combination of these things which makes it unique.

I do not think the weapon switch or movement reduces the capacity for strategy/skill in a game. There is a fine balance to find in all this and simply slowing player movement and slowing weapon switch speed adds nothing if it's not balanced appropriately.

Maps have a VERY important role in player movement and the consequences of weapon switch speed. The placement of weapons/armors/items as well as even minor geometry can change the impact of movement/switch speed on matches.

so pressing a button before a fight is "just another avenue of skill and strategy"? in that case, let's have 2 second weapon switch delays, it must obviously add an entirely new layer of depth and complexity

You pay for it if you use a railgun up close, for example.

you pay for it in faster switches as well

edit: loltags

ur dum.

slow weapon switch and especially reduced movement (more like slow)

ā la counter-strike!

Just no

NO IT TAKES AWAY FROM THE HARDCORE HAVING TO WAIT ON YOUR WEAPON CHOICE AND NOT RELYING SO MUCH ON REACTION TIME SO YOU HAVE TO CHOOSE YOUR WEAPONS AND FIGHTS MORE TACTICALLY LOLOLo!l!oL!ol!1Ol

that's the argument against it. versus being able to have more complex fights involving more weapons, having reaction time be a more deciding factor during fights, and seeing various different weapon combos in quick succession.

it's a preference thing, as I would also prefer fast switch, but a lot of people prefer slow switch.

I think people just "prefer" what they played more of.

How about a "faster" switch?

Not insta like cpm but not as slow as QL?

Would be a nice middleground.

kinda like in tribes: ascend, i would be fine with that

that is generally what prefer means.

CROUCH SLIDING FTW!!!

All these fast switching debates are disappointing.

I do not play cpm/promode because I can not properly switch my weapons on my mousewheel with that instaswitch crap.

Think about the casuals too: most new players will be glad to be able to use their wheel. Binds are for advanced gamers.

Debate closed: reasonably slow weapon switch it is. Period.

:)

No more than five weapons would probably be ideal, as well.

pressing a button to switch to a weapon, advanced game

9 weapons to bind, still dont know how one can use binds for movement and be accurate at switching to any desired weapon without significant practice.

WSAD, Ctrl, shift and space to move for me, then the rest of the keyboard is free for weapons.

Also, I have never shown quake to any new player who prefer mwheel for wep. switch. Every single one simply ask me what key for what wep and they learn it.

probably because your mates had played cs or some shizzle. It's still more intuitive with the wheel, and that is actually what the default quake cfg is.

Actually, binding the weapons to individual keys or buttons is intuitive, as I've seen with anyone that has ever tried Quake, total newb or seasoned gamer. I digress. Balanced weapon switching and less weapons would be better for Reborn.