guyz a u rly still playing qw tdm, i mean almost 15 years passed and 1st fps game....fastrockets, no weapon drops, 666/satan maps, BH-oping...i mean...why? why so deeply infected?)

addiction to old games its rly something strange, i mean....

yes, dont tell me qw is cool, i still playing once a week some TF modification, but it is very differ from original TF and u guyz still playing qw td, dm3 map - just dont undertand, why? we got perfect cybersport FPS - quake3, but why still on qw?

nostalgia? best years of you life gone with QW - forget it.

and..its all about RL not balanced at all, boomstik RL, RL boomstick.

those people are so skilled that you won't even notice how fast you have died

"its my true opinion about QW" - it is a retard opinion about a game you never tried, fixed that for you

please go somewhere else with your opinion about old games.

I been playing Custom TF modification till nowdays - its on q1 engine, so i find q1 engine cool engine :-) but 'our' game was developed and modifed by community from 2000 or so, so its not original TF anymore, gameplay, weapons, classes - everything changes and it's more fun, thats how old games should live forever.

But qw tdm is still the same only huds and gfx modern stuff changes, so i tryed tdm in q1 q2 q3 q4 ET, ETQW - so i find q1 tdm out of date, not balanced weapons and very spcific gameplay based on BH-oping and mad RL domination.


q1 game was developed long time ago and not serious modifed >12 years. So i find q3 better balanced and tdm gameplay.

Just curious why those guys till playing :-0 what is the fun playing so old and not perfect game, concerning weapons balance and other stuff.

>please go somewhere else with your opinion about old games.
i find its perfect place to share thought about fps games, not seen anything wrong with it. if you have another opinion - plz share with us, tell us why you like q1 or q3 and for what.

I feel like I am talking with a wall.

http://www.esreality.com/post/2004316/n-a/#pid2004316

Without opening it assumed it to be ddks post.. and it was! Thx for finding it :D

Gotta say I might write it differently these days and be a little less biased against QL TDM but the points about QW are still very true! :) As we're on the topic I might as well throw out some thoughts, there are many things I'd change but after playing more lately here are a couple things of the most important and why:

I think one of the most annoying things about QL TDM to me after playing it a lot recently with sitto is that you can't reliably spawn frag by holding important areas.

An obvious example: dm6 in osp vs dm6 in ql: In ql if you hold the RA, you get the RA, but it's not that useful because it doesn't really protect you that much as all the weapons are very damaging and easily accessible. But imagine if like in OSP, holding the RA not only gave you the RA, but also netted your team frags by the fact you have secured the area that has position above the 2 spawn locations (as in OSP). It adds a "domination" type effect, where you know that if you hold that area and people are dying that you'll get average +X frags per minute. It wouldn't be as easy as that though, because you'd need the appropriate weapons and to be watching the console to see who is dying to know when to throw rockets down onto the spawns.

To achieve this we'd have to add the spawn back in QL and make the spawn system good again for TDM. This would mean that there'd be more structure in the game as teams would have more motivation to actually attack or hold that area, it would seem much less FFA-like. It would also result in more exciting gameplay as it's much easier to recover frag deficits quickly and teams would get that strategical choice of either biasing the Railgun or the RA side of the map, where if a good quadrun lets you lock both down you start fragging like crazy etc. This has a positive effect on the viewing experience as well, as like QW the game will have a much clearer narrative. Quad Runs would be more exciting as well as you shoot long distance shots to the spawns and rack up more frags or whatever like in the OSP days.

One funny thing about the spawn system in QL TDM is evident on dm14. On dm14 in OSP you had someone stand at the RA-RL to pick up spawn frags, in QL you have someone stand there to prevent anyone spawning at the back of RA. Sure if your team is moving around perfectly with good item timing people spawning there won't be much of a problem but I think it's an interesting distinction to note on how it affects gameplay.

Quake isn't a newbie friendly game and it never was, the fact that spawn fragging was nerfed/altered for duel, fine, whatever I don't care, but for TDM? That's no way to treat this manly game(mode). Oh and this would also have an interesting effect on mapping too, it would be easier for mappers as they have an extra consideration on how to balance a map properly. We wouldn't have to make every map like this, but it would be a way to increase gameplay diversity whilst having some less forgiving elements that make the game more exciting.

The other thing that goes hand-in-hand with this that I'd change is to make spawner hp 100 instead of 125. There is no longer a 100 damage railgun, why keep 125 spawning hp? Resources in TDM shouldn't be given for free, they need to be earned. This change would also have the good effect of making the rocket a great tool vs spawners. I think that's a nice change is because the RL is a predictive weapon and with these modern netcode changes the hitscan weapons are stronger, let's give the RL more situational use - suddenly the way we'd think about it as a resource changes.

In duel it's different as a spawner has little to no strength. But in QL TDM spawners are way too strong, their strength is sometimes individually enough to have an effect on the control. I understand that there will never be a boomstick in TDM which is what I think makes the most sense due to my appreciation for QW, but I think lowering the spawn hp is the best compromise to keep it feeling Q3'ish.

So in conclusion to this poorly written post, I would like to make changes that make the game more fast-paced, more teamplay oriented whilst still keeping an emphasis on fighting. One of the beauties of QW is that it's extremely teamplay based but also single players absolutely stand out. The game has a structured narrative but very dynamic gameplay. A better spawn system with less spawner hp would move QL TDM gameplay closer to this.

So shortly said: Spawns + More powerful armors + Less spawnhealth = More teamplay + Items (armors) more important + Area controlling would actually have benefits and make a difference with lots less FFA :)

Right? :)

More or less, I tried to pick on things I felt would be really easy to change. There's more stuff I would change like the armour system, spawn weapon etc, but it's stuff that would be too much at once to implement or it's something that would make the game feel less like q3 as I begin to mix elements I think create awesome gameplay from qw/cpm. idSoftware should give me my own special ability to change all these things for testing xD. But yeah, the idea is to promote more teamplay and having that reward you with more frags per minute whilst still keeping fighting as a really important element that allows one player to stand out just as much as his teams ability to teamplay like in qw. OSP had the spawn system, it also had 100dmg rails and worse netcode.

Well QL:DDK is surely in IDs release list now I hope! ;) And there is always small things to change to make it better but I do think making a cup or minor tournament for the scene could have a big impact if that would be possible.

Since TDM isn't that much played on publics due to IDs (2 proper tdm maps/month) tactics this isn't something that could be tried on publics and would find a crowd. This is something that should be accepted by the "pros" first after testing and once they've started liking it -> it could be implemented as standard tdm. And that would be awesome :>

I'd like to see this streamed or watch it trough some GTV client with you casting to see the depth of the game.

I can agree with most points you have about QL:TDM, though I really think it has more depth than it is shown on any streamed game.

You only need to say that QW TDM hasn't changed anything during the years to tell us all how little you know about it :)
Other things that also confirms this is: RL domination, bunnyhopping and that not balanced weapons are a problem, while it's actually one of the best parts of the game and what makes it different, etc etc :)

Is it megatf you are playing or what custom modification?

AGR Custom TF, not Mega TF - Mega TF suck cause it is more fun mod rather gameplay mod.

And Mega TF is not Custom based classes, custom classes gives more variations

Ok, this is why I asked since I assumed it wasn't Mega TF since it's like some kind of arcade version of the orginal TF :)

So you are asking why QWers play QW TDM when you admit to playing some custom TF based on old QW stuff? o_O

Why don't you sign up for the draft and find out why people play QW still.

qw tdm and agr custom tf is very diferent mods, yes they based on quake engine but gameplay and teamplay is different.

so tdm and tf modes are different but tf inculdes dm skills and we got some ex tdm players also.

agr (custom tf) been developing from original tf from 2003 till nowdays and its more about team coordinatinong rather RL spawn kills and frags mess, so its not kinda so old.

qw tdmers plays same maps and same rules from 1995, same RL domination, 2 maps: dm2, dm3.

we got tons of maps, many gameplay improvements, code changing, new models, tons of new features and some epic features that u cannot find in ANY modern fps, for ex. flying transapent cameras that represents observers in game, so you can see what observers (spectating players) do in match and much more.

i do not have anything bad about qw tdm, even fun to watch some casts, buts it kinda very specific for me comraring all novelties in fps games from 1995.

so guess all oldschoolers play more for fun rather for WIN and ELO's and all this modern 'achievements', so u can join every week and talk to USA, EU, Australia guys and play some macthes - its like a coffee time, the score almost no matter but the fun from gameplay is real pleasure, suppose qw tdm receive their fun too, but its kinda specific for me.

so its all about tastes

are you seriously playing that shit ? watched some video on youtube, what an awful game it seems to be :E why oh why

edit:
I MEAN WHAT THE F..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GCFJdYbGy-Q

So you jundglement is kinda overtolled based on not quality demo watching.
This game has unique gameplay, you never played this, i did play qw tdm and this, so i can judge.

For me "same shit" is qw tdm, CA, CS. brainless, fast meat FFA mess - 2 playbale maps. RL domination etc.

Plz more agruments troll :-) Its better to shit with good arguments, try it)

Even the promo video doesn't make the game appealling, it really looks like shit. You have to work a bit on your marketing !

exactly.

>it really looks like shit
more agruments troll
so its not close an argument

Ok, " it looks like shit" means thait it looks like an amateur mod from 1999, with mouth-made sound effects, models stolen from other games, and retardspam weapons. Do you understand better now ?

"brainless, fast meat FFA mess"

joke of the year.. :E

qw tdm:
1. very dynamic gameplay, for you 18 years old CA lovers
2. not balanced weapons. RL vs SSG (RL won), RL vs SNG (RL won), RL vs Boomstick (...),RL vs Nailgun (...), RL vs Shaft (more RL won), RL vs GL (RL won)
3. extra fast rockets, fastest ever all quakes, huge splash damage
4. 2 playable maps from 1995: dm2, dm3
5. same code from qw times
6. no weapon drops
7. more spawn kills with RL
8. extremely low amount of overtimes
9. focused on frags only
10. oldschool community, >30 y.o quakers from 1995 mostly from sweden, fin, nor....

class based modes:
ET, ETQW, Custom TF, Tribes, Brink, TF-2
1. unique team play and coordination
2. involves all fps skills + extra team coordination, the goal is a flag, capture points, objectives etc = more intereting.
3. not so focused on frags (kills) but on real pure team play
4. games like 8v8 and more is interesting due more tactical combinations/situations
5. you can choose what class/positions is better for you or fit your playstyle/skills
6. you can change your class/position/strategy depends on game situation
7. more smart play that involes real team coordination, so individual skills still matters but not so as team skills
8. variety, variety, variety, variety, variety

Arguments of trolls:
"it is a retard opinion about a game you never tried, fixed that for you"
"it really looks like shit"
"are you seriously playing that shit ? "
"so apparently you like to eat shit"

To be fair here you can replace "qw tdm" with "any tdm" when you compare it to any class based modes ;)

I've played class based games like the original QW TF and Tribes. I don't think they are better. Basically class based games are the equivalent of taking the Quake guy and dividing up his arsenal and abilities into separate classes. So you end up with a RL class, a LG class, a fast moving class, a slow moving class, a spamming class, a sniper class, etc. All it really does is lower skill and dynamics. In Quake TDM you have to adjust on the fly to very complex and different situations. In class based games the permutations are lowered dramatically and players are often forced into roles by rules.

A good example is Tribes Ascend, snipers utterly dominate defense but they are limited to 1 per team. If the game had balance you wouldn't need to artificially impose limits but most class based games suffer from imbalance. Usually one or a few classes are so much more important that team success depends entirely on them. In Quake TDM anyone can step up their game and carry the weight of the team for a win with great play but skill dictates that, not what class you play.

All your points are about variety and teamplay. In class based games variety and teamplay are artificial and forced by game design. Each player class is limited by design. In Quake you can get anything but when you are light on weapons, ammo or items you are basically comparable to a class as you don't have full abilities yet. That's why Quake is better because you start with nothing and can get it all. In Quake when you just have rail you are a sniper class, when you just have grenades you are a spammer, etc but once you have everything you'll be an anchor of the team. Quake offers up comparable situations to class based gameplay but also offers more situations where you have the master class with all abilities, something class based games lack.

trolololo

Well it's like you said, it's "all about tastes" so apparently you like to eat shit. The fact you don't even know QW TDM is primarily based around TB3 (The Big 3, aka 3 maps) and keep talking about 2 maps just shows how lost you are. Comparing CA and CS to any version of TDM proves how little insight you have.

e: i'm a mean person

well, that was a lot of stupid shite. merry xmas!

what's wrong with 666/satan maps

damn I wanna play! :< Maybe I can cast the games at least, I'll keep ppl updated on whether or not I can do that!

Yes cast!!!

do it

I'm quite glad to see the draft league doing so great in EU. Based on the matches and demos I've watched I can't remember the last time EQL/NQR Div1 was so competitive and interesting. There's been so many surprises and upsets that it makes it very compelling to spectate (and I imagine play in). I was very happy to see Zero win last season.

its*

ddk is wrong, nined is right. fuck you tb3!