To be honest the raw feeling and shape of MS 3.0 is better than all of those mice you listed. The only improvement would be the cable is better on those mice compared to MS 3.0 and of course a chance of higher dpi.

The downside of the mice you listed is that they all have smoothing, higher lift off distance, worse shape and worse coating.

From the list I would say Zowie EC1 eVo would be the best choice. But the eVo also has smoothing, wierd dpi steps, unstable polling rate, huge button delay and a very low lift off distance.

Why not buy a Ninox Aurora, the change of shape might be better for your aim. Fazz imo is aiming better with an ambidextrous abyssus than he did when he played with the MS 3.0.

W M O
M
O

Logitech 4 life

went for logitech g100s after 10yrs of msie30

looks like the wmo, which disapears in my hand.
Can you even palm grib with such a mouse?

you definitely wouldn't want to palm grip a g100s

Eh? I palm-claw mine and the back of it feels rly huge. Dunno why people usually think that it's a small mouse whereas it's actually pretty fucking big

5 cm hands

not really, average hand

no way someone could think a g100s is 'pretty fucking big' when it's one of the smallest gaming mice you can get, other than having small hands. sry mate.

well im not saying that it's one of the huge mice but it's bigger than kinzu/kana/abyssus/aurora/fk/am/whatever cause it got more chubby shape

small hands. sry mate.

"bigger than kinzu/kana/abyssus/aurora/fk/am/whatever"

i have used all of these except the kinzu, and the g100s is smaller than all of them (about equal to aurora)

I used all of them aswell and i can't palm grip any of those like g100s(well maybe only kana)

ye you can palm it. i do like h8m3, palm-claw, it's actually a better fit for me than ie3.

Just get a G400 like a normal person.

The g400 looks like the mx518 form, which has the numb "aim-feel" equivalent of having a ski glove on while laying on your back.

What mouse should he get then, n00b?

read the entire thread babo.

Just in case anyone was wondering what babo meant:

"Stupid" or "idiot" in Korean

OR

A really cute little ugly doll, who loves cookies.

Source: Urbandictionary.com

You're welcome.

Zowie EC1/2 evo CL

The button lag felt horrible, switched just because of that.

IE 3.0 / IO 1.1 have "laggy" buttons as well

you can get an alcor but don't epect it to last more than 5-6 months

Nowhere near as laggy as the EC mice also, if you're referring to the button response chart IIRC the IE3 was tested on 125hz or was it an IO 1.1?

Also, I know someone who's been using the Alcor since about a month after release with now apparent issues yet, aside from that I haven't continued to use mine, but my cousin is using it at the moment and has been using it for the past 4 months at least and I've not heard anything from him as of yet.

i think both of them have about 13ms delay according to utmalesoldiers.com

anyway, my alcor is about 9 months old, mouse5 double clicks all the time, cm storm logo LED is flickering, bottom right foot is about to come off because there's a fair amount of empty space between the skates and the mouse sockets, scroll wheel acts ups occasionally as well ...

it's smaller than a IE 3.0 mind you, feels like a mini deathadder. look around for a DA 3.5 G regular / black edition and call it a day.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-XlqFfGQPaGI/VGZgkn5...dy_tl8.png

IME 3.0 tested at 125hz.

you should use EC2 or deathadder. you are lucky!

From your list, Alcor or G402.
EDIT: Zowie mice generally have a significant button lag because of what might just be subpar PCBs.
Deathadders in general are a firmware and driver wank nightmare.

Steelseries Rival, not sure about the sensor performance but it has pretty similar shape/size.

Alcor or EC1/2 evo

I've tried to use a DeathAdder for a long time but went back to ie3. Then I heard good things about ZOWIE EC1 eVo, got it, and I think it's perfect. I would prefer it has deathadder 2013 shape, rubber grips, wheel lightness, but as a shape/sensor combo, it's the best modern replacement so far.

I've been using an Alcor since April or so, very satisfied.
I also own a Deathadder(3G or whatever it's called, basically the very first model), and a Zowie EC2(an ever-so-slightly smaller version of EC1). No idea about the G402.
Out of those 3, the Alcor is the clear winner to me.
It is also the most lightweight palm grip mouse atm, if lighter is your preference, which it is for most ppl, far as I know.

The DA 3G I own has an older sensor(I guess...) and skips or has neg. accel on some pads like mz artisan shidenkai but other than that it's a great mouse, and I assume newer versions have an upgraded sensor. It's somewhat larger and heavier than Alcor.

The Zowie EC2 is also good, however, almost double the price of the Alcor. I didn't like the huge feet on them, and had to replace them.
I didn't like the custom lens, which reduces LoD, and may make it unable to function with certain surfaces or have too low LoD...
I prefer tape solution in order to reduce high LoD.
The buttons are quite delayed unfortunately, this was VERY NOTICEABLE after I had switched to Alcor.
Other than that it's still an alright mouse, although definitely overpriced - I wouldn't recommend it today.

The Alcor is basically perfect, very good low delay buttons, sensor works as it should, and for the first time I didn't have to replace feet with hyperglides, in fact still using the stock ones.
The CM logo LED is unfortunately very bright, and there is no software to turn it off with, so I just have a piece of black tape there to cover it. My only small issue is that it only comes in the normal non-glossy finish(I had the white glossy version of the Zowie), which can be difficult to hold as I have dry skin. So I just use a bit of hand cream often.

good luck

Do you know what the difference between Alcor and Mizar is? It looks like Mizar is more of an IE3 shaped mouse to me, but I can't really tell.
edit:
nevermind, most of my questions were answered here: http://www.overclock.net/t/1473246/review-and...-and-mizar

I don't remember, I think they're pretty much the same. Mizar has a laser sensor, and a driver software.
http://www.overclock.net/t/1467478/cm-storm-m...by-takasta

Yeah, both negatives in my mind. I was slightly excited, but looks like LoD sucks too. Oh well, EC1 it is for now. I do really wish it was shaped more like original IE3 and had DA'13 rubber pads...

Get all of them + rival and keep the one you like the most, they all have their little quirks and differences you may or may not like.

Or go to a local store, should be pretty easy to find one where you can "grip before you buy" in Copenhagen.

The Ikari Optical is an underappreciated mouse for the price. Feels like a convenient transition shape-wise as well.

CM Alcor seems really nice, like a lighter version of the IME 3.0, 87g compared to IME's 100g. If it wasn't for the 4mm liftoff distance I would seriously consider upgrading my IME 3.0 but low liftoff is a must for me.

Here's a review of it: http://www.overclock.net/t/1467478/cm-storm-m...by-takasta

LoD ain't 4mm lol, that would be insane. It's more like 1.5-2mm(checked on black cloth pad since that's pretty standard for comparison). Dunno how they made those measurements. Some newer firmwares were also meant to change LoD but they didn't, for me. I use the default FW it works nicely and I like the 800dpi and 6/11 winsens for windows and any apps/games without raw input.
And if you feel that LoD is too high you can always do tape-trick, simples.

I've done the tape with DA, and it's just not very consistent, sometimes it gets stuck. Also, apparently the measurement shows its 'jittery'.

been reading your input and some reviews,
think i´ll buy the alcor, as it is cheap as f....
and then get the deathadder if im not pleased with the alcor.
seems like the two best MS IE 3.0 imitations out there.

the g402 has received even better praise than the others, but the shape is apparetly not that similar to the IE 3.0.

Thanks for the input.

some people said deathadder 2013 and chroma versions got smoothing.

I played with the DA 2k13 for quite some time and didn't notice any lag at all. But that might be me :), maybe there's still smoothing even if don't notice it :)

however most people didn't complain about smoothing in the DA 3G and 3.5G version, so if you're bothered with smoothing (unlike me) go get previous versions of deathadder, not 2k13 or chroma.

What makes you write off the EC1 if I may ask? I got it as a replacement for my favorite IE3 and have never looked back. Razer on the other hand brings back bad memories even if I know that the DA is probably their only real good mouse(a huge part of it being exactly due to the shape).

its my 3rd pick only due to low availibility and high price in Denmark.
seems just as capable as the DA, with better "drivers" and a better out of the box experience but the shape the DA apparently fits the spot better.

but ill try the Alcor and then reevaluate if i'm not satisfied.

I would say the EC1 fits the IME 3.0 shape the best. It has rounded edges on the mouse buttons and the right side lip is also rounded to give extra space for the finger to wrap around.

If my memory is correct the DA feels a bit fatter than the IE3. Just held it one time, never played with it, so grain of salt and whatnot. Just now tried my broken IE3 and the EC1 feels a tiny bit smaller even though when looking at them both it looks ever so slightly bigger. I can take a few pics of them side by side if you like but I can tell you right now they look exactly the same. From my one time experience with the DA I can tell you that all three mice feel great so whichever floats your boat. Although I am curious how a razer can be cheaper than... well anything.

I've been using the 3.0 shape and Logitech 5xx/G400 shape, now I'm on the Logitech 502. The part in your hand feels about the same, so it's all good.

Ball mice for life. Mice with balls sucka! All other mice are pussy cat food.

Use lower resolution. Problem solved.

I like the 402g. First logitech mouse i've liked. Used ms 3.0 > DA > FK > 402g Tried and discarded lots of different mice in between.