woohoo, it's kinda cool that we were able to conclude this. I mean, we spent the best part of 4 hrs minus the time we spent in the tourney on it.

His name is Satan, after all.

hahaha, that demo is so goddamn funny
"pb?" xD
I just can't stop laughing, I wonder what your sponsors will say about that.

hf shooting walls when you play bots in the future, wp satan!

well it was quite obvious, stupid krauts trying to protect eachother :(

Yeah, I mean who would defend a cheat?

an actual cheat or just silly cheat accusations? i guess spyte

also: bump'd

probated*

oh snap

ffs y ruin it for the others??? :-/

blatant hacking... theres tons of people in the US that do the same thing, maybe our hackers are smarter than your hackers or something? they're not AS detectable as this dumb guy satan.. punkbuster sure is a vital tool huh?

satan always cheats, he's a funny guy... lol

i thought he had autoshooter after watching his btourney games

nice one guys :)

thankies!

???
I actually reinstalled Quake III for this and I'm not being funny or questing fox's judgement, but why do you think he's cheating?
I watched many parts of the demo with Timescale set at 0.3 and his aim was not good at all at many times.
Look at his shaft in the 2nd demo, it's all over the place.
Also the bit near the pillars, Storm is on the floor, Satan fluffs many SG shots, also, his chain gun is all over over the place (near the pillars), you can see him constatnly trying to update to track his opponent and he is still missing?
As for what fox said around 05:38? And???
He spammed a load of plasma. And?
Seemed to me as if Satan was very much a prediction player which is not surprising see as the people who still play Quake III are probably entering the 6 year of playing Dm6.
Could it be that they might just have a an idea of where enemies are?

I would be the first one to flame someone if I thought they were cheating, but I'm really curious as to why some people think so?
Perhaps they could list exact time situation like fox did?

Also, I'm pretty sure Satan would not be retarded enough to SEND you the demos of him cheating as he knows people would go over them with a low timescale.
Could it be that he's really that stupid?

I remember a journal or you saying something like this a while ago.
To be honest I think you're wrong here and your desire to win combined with the reality of a loss has had a bad impact.
The only thing that makes me doubt myself a tiny bit is fox's word, btu I HAVE SEEN cheat demos before and they were obvious. I fail to see the evidence in this one.

Damn, I just ran around dm6 and it was sweet. I must uninstall before my addiction comes back.
Misses the railgun!

wallhack isn't obvious if you're smart.

but his aimbot at times is blatant, just look at the way he aims.

plus the plasma bit fox points out... it's like "WTF ARE YOU SPAMMING AT?!" then a couple seconds later, i come jumping out the door at full speed. now if that's not aimbot, that's definetly wallhack.

and all the missing? yeah, he probably wants to lower the accuracies.

So can Aimbots be binded so they come on and off?
I thought they were always on or off. I never used them so I don't know.
As for spamming, don't you spam at times where you suspect players are going to be?

A good example is spamming grenades as you come out of the teleport on ztn.
Another example is spamming rockts from the YA on ZTN down to the MH a few seconds before it spawns.
I just don't see him spamming that plasma to warrant it being a valid point.
Like I said, I have seen blatant aimbot demos and I saw nothing in this demo which indicated he had some sort of aimbot.
you must admit it's strange that someone who is aimbotting would make teh demos public?
It just don't make sense.

yer, that fox guy is clueless, he must be new :/

look at the plasma spam though, he predicts me EXACTLY - look at how much he fires. he even fires it in a manner to compensate for my speed which is something that was very unpredictable as i was coming so fast through the door.

so what the hell is that punkbuster thing for? =/

Some people get around whatever is built to stop them.
It can be a good trait, but not if abused.

"So can Aimbots be binded so they come on and off?"

Of course.

why do you bother posting ..... at all

"Arguning on the internet is like the special olympics. Even if you win you are still retarded".

that one hurt.

regardless, the fact that you only point out the times where he aimed badly when its blatantly an attempt to cover up his cheat is my reasoning behind me asking you why you bother posting..... at all, thank you for your opinion though, it was entertaining :)

I realise people like yourself gain pleasure from people replying to your flamebait so I was happy to give you your fix of sadness.

Well WTF else was there to comment on?
His aiming was hardly godlike, in fact it was pretty dire.
So what else shall I comment on?
Oh the fact that he spammed a shit load of plasma?
It's not valid, the game is years old, he's been playing for years.
Players can develop that "I have a feeling he's there sense" I see it all the time online.
Ever just had that feeling someone is hiding at xspot and you were right?
It's called intuition.
I'm just saying the reasons given don't seem conclusive to me, especially given the fact he posted hjis own demo.
Would you give up a demo of you cheating?
I'm not saying he did or did not just trying to get an accurate conclusion. He should be banned from any tourney in future if true.

so if you have nothing else to comment on but the moments where hes trying to make himself look less of a player, you just blurt it out anyway?

take a careful look at the demo and dont just look at the parts where he sucks and point out the obvious, cause thats the whole point of him posting the demo, so people could see how much he "sucked" at times.

i dont flamebait i just dont see any other way to reply to you ;]

ur points may be valid but they are pretty shit.
HE IS NOT GOING TO MAKE IT BLATNTLY OBVIOUS THAT HE CHEATS THAT WOULD JUST BE STUPID. WHO CARES IF YOU'VE SEEN AIMBOT DEMOS BEFORE? NOT EVERYONE CAN HIDE THEM WELL. BOTTING CAN BE BINDED ON AND OFF, A PRIME EXAMPLE OF THIS IS WHEN PsY>xoom GOT CAUGHT.

No disrespect but you're one of the few people on ESR I would ever listen to and take their word for gospel so save your energy for refreshing game servers.
You might be the same thing about me, but I am trying to conclude if a point is valid as opposed to ramming it down peoples throat.
Also I know you're a noob from seeing you play, so spare us the CAPS. It just tells everyone else.

Let me break it down for you..

The accusation is about an Aimbot, I saw very few shots from satan which implied he was using an AIM BOT, thus I questioned it.

It could be possible that he is using some sort of wall hack which gives him an indication of the position of his enemy, but that is a lot harder to prove than using an aimbot. It also not what was reported.
Hence why there is a discussion.

You may respond to insult my character to make yourself feel better, but just remember to keep with the topic.
*Edit*
Second thoughts I already know your reply so i'm blocking you as you always talk crap. Welcome to the club.

the accusation was more-so of some kind of cheat as storm says; "agree that hes using some sort of a wallhack/aimbot." we never accused of an aimbot, but we thought wallhack was very likely from some of the stuff he did to us on dm6 and ztn.

though if you watch his lg sometimes, it's a little more obvious than the 'jerky' rail flicks (if that makes sense). his aim sort of bounce sup and down, like a quake3 bot does only in a more natural looking way. it's quite subtle but he's got an aimbot there somewhere.

im on the topic. and as for noob, hardly, since ive been playing a few years now. yea uve seen me play from the times i used to dick u on ztn ezily ;-).
capslock for teh win!

(...)I saw very few shots from satan which implied he was using an AIM BOT(...)

so there was some?

Well done, your first 2 sentences were the most incoherent I have ever had the displeasure of reading. Keep up the good work. Also there were no attacks of character untill you called him a noob for no apparent reason (which only reinforces almost everybody on esr's opinion of you), and then you have the nerve to tell him to stay on topic when the only one deviating is you. I know i should have ignored you a while ago, but its just so fun to watch you talk yourself into a corner.

obviously he isnt going to make it blatntly obvious that he cheats that would be just plain dumb. He sent the demo because he probably thought he was hiding it well or because people would want to know why he wouldnt send them, which could make it more suspect that hes hiding something.

if you'd done what i wrote, which is timescale 0.1 and zoom in at that time, you would see that the millisecond his hitbox comes in line of sight, satan's crosshair jerks upwards, flawlessly predicting 3-4 shots in the exact trajectory of rage. there really is nothing to discuss. watch it again.

its not the fact that he's spamming there blind, lots of good players do that. its that little flick in that exact moment.

so harsh!

I feel for you steve man, you too rage

haven't even read what this is all about but satan has been cheating for years. i actually posted a demo of him way back when he was in c58.eu here on esr and i remember he got it deleted :p
he was kicked out of every major german league in his "career"...
gonna watch the demos now and have a laugh :)

If he has a history of cheating then that's fine. I just wanted to find out for myself if he was cheating.
I just find it hard to believe a cheater would be stupid enough to post a demo of him cheating.
And the reasons like the plasma gun are not valid.
He's probably played the game/map 10,000 times, don't you suspect he might actually have a good idea of where opponents are?

Ever done something in a game which defies logic?
Ever just had that feeling your enemy is at x-spot waiting for an item etc?
People can develop those senses if they have played enough games. It has to do with the limbic brain but it's pointelss to explain.
I'm just saying it don't seem conclusive to me when every aimbot demo I have seen before has been BLATANT.

yeah but firstly, that kind of knowledge is better than that of the ice climbers for instance. you don't waste about 20plasma shots on spam for no reason, seriously. and the spread he fired them in was just messed up - it was relative to the huge ups that i was coming through the door at.

being so finely attuned as that is impossible, it would take another 2 - 3 years, unless you're someone as smart as czm, fox, zero4, unkind ( and so on ).

storm points out on quite a few occasions to satan, and i've pointed out also that; we're not newbs, we've played some of the best players in the world and we've never been raped in such a manner - this is why storm disconnected at first. maybe that sounds cocky and arrogant but it lead us to suspect him and actually prove it. so think what you will :)

you arrogant TWAT

for real man, you know it!

are you for real?

what.

well it's different for me cos i played the guy and i know he cheats for sure... when you play a cheater you kinda 'feel it' not sure how to explain it, comes with experience and having played maybe the best players at some time and therefore knowing what's possible and what's not.
in the demo the 'feel' is only really visible with his rails - they're 'too fast' and when looking at it with low fov you realize even before he's shooting if he's gonna hit or not. kinda hard to explain tho :/
you also see him 'scanning' the map and shooting bs shots to get his accuracy down right after he checked his stats and realized they were too high :)
this one's a cheat demo for sure and you shouldn't defend the guy he's not worth it and has been cheating for years.

I'm not defending the guy i don't know him.
If he has a history of cheating then maybe so, but there are far too many ego's in Quake III which can turn into green eyed monsters when they lose after so much time playing.

I think before you string someone up it needs to be conclusive.

lol. Jamerio. you know why we were suprised? well. we've both known satan before, and when he plays without bots/wh. he's nothing special at all. I don't know how you can get to the standard of a fox or tox after 1month of practise. if so enlighten me, cause that'd be really awesome.

we didn't take anything up with the admins until after they played a second game with which we watched satan the whole 40minutes. then we asked calipt and draven what they thought about it, whether they felt the same as us, and they agreed. so following that we all got in a channel, spoke to the admins about it, got demos, watched/reviewed them -- then as that is proof the admin had reason to take it up with some more people. I then linked it to fox cause i recalled that fox had played them recently, so i wanted to know his opinion too.

and the "far too many green eyed monsters", well if you read all of storms journal you'll find that there's nothing to do with jealousy. -anywhere-. also as it states RIGHT at the beginning "Myself and rage signed up as DC for this tourney hoping that it'd be something fun to do". this should be enough to indicate that we were just entering for fun rather than glory. so i don't see how this applies.

Not saying it was jealousy. just saying when people want to win they can get emotional.
I have no idea of satans past, though I guess by his name I can guess.

he didn't post a demo of him cheating, he posted a demo where he thought we couldn't spot his cheat.

he doesnt cheat.. storm and rage are just 2 newbs.. (played some of the best in the world) ?

rofl yeh right.. u havnt played me yet..

ur fucking dire at q3. instagibby nub.

lolll

rofl.. if u say so steg..

pann = g-r0'd x10 i think

haha oh it's pannet0.. that just made my day.

hasn't changed one bit :)

oh mighty steg one, thy have spoken!

by the way..

ive played in TDM vs aNc vs yourself storm and satan.. with PsY and you was both as shit as each over..

cheat whine? thats even worse than my nazi whine!

played you in 2v2 before, played against you in tdm before.

i'm not gonna stoop to your level cause i really don't care about your opinion so. whatever man.

its quite obvious that he's using WH.. for the aimbot thing i'm not sure tbh.. there are some strange situations but it can also be luck or a good day..

oh forgot to say, well done catching him :-)

yea wp.

he's either botting or a jedi

maybe both?!?!

haha, i love jedi

The rail is just so obvious, it's outrageous. Even on timescale 1 you can cleary notice a difference between the rails he hits with bot and the ones without (which he mostly misses). And I've never seen anyone spamming rails in walls and rooms where obviously no enemy is around, except for cheaters who try to lower their accuracies. The fact that he always starts to spam after checking his by far too high stats with +wstats is another evidence imo.

all spyteman tbh :D

? :D

hes just using the shoot command and the wallhack on them
which is why theres almost 0 lg usage as the lg sticks out a mile as an aimbot to everyone when using the shoot command as it does burst fire.

which makes instant hit weaps perfect ie. shotgun+rail which he uses fucking loads

all in all, TEH HAX!!>@>!

i actually can't agree he's using wallhack,, though i haven'T searched the whole demo yet.
and this scene at 5:38 is no proof at all, for he is not going for rage at this moment, but for storm !
if you are at YA, and the enemy is up on rail, WITH a rail, the most likely event to come is, that the rail enemy comes down in order to hit you with the rail, and satan is just spamming plasma there in order to keep storm from doing that. in fact, when rage arrives storm comes jumping down, just as satan has predicted.
THIS scene, is no proof at all.
i'd like to have a look at some moere "scenes" you find so suspicious, could you post exact times and actions ?

read #52

haha! i was asking myself how satan became such a good player within a month or so... but i never thought about cheats.
what i'm always thinking when i see such a dude play, is: "how can someone own that much with that movement / aim? it looks like he uses a 5 year old ballmouse!"
i'm not gonna play satan anymore :P

I'd like to know how many people call YOU a cheater... getting pointed with your average 40% lg is just sick! :D

he's too sexy to be a cheater... :)

also i think he doesnt know how to do it... or he is too lazy to learn it :D

I do not own, but i've played q3 only for years, but my movement is still horrible and i'll never it right, in any game :/
I guess movement is talent or smt.

Got loads of demos of satan from German pubs back in 2002/3. The good thing about him was that he used to use the name 'satan', so you always knew there wasn't a sudden influx of cheaters on the servers or anything.

I remember one time he aliased as a famous German player at the time... Crush3r, I think? Usually he used the name 'satan' though. Can't believe he's STILL doing this after all this time, doesn't he find it boring, lol?

if you have demos, can you please post em then?
atleast put a few where your certain he cheats, maybe that'll resolve this thing finally.

rofl, you can also see how he looks to an upper level through the ceiling very quickly, then catching the enemy there.

bugger i want to watch this now, no q3 on this pc tho, will have to wait till sunday :<

he cheats 100%
dont wanna write much, he doesnt deserve it :)
€: thx to Storm for posting this, i was too lazy and was waiting for someone like you :) i have some "nice" demos too if anyone interested

hehe post em
cheating demos are fun :D

oki, ill upload them on monday if i am at home

yeah give us demos!

ricky PsY still got owned ? yea ok GG NO RE newbie.

hi to storm and rage long time no see mates ^^

actually i was mercing for psy.. and psy won.. u probably beat psy in other games when i wasnt playing..

did what you told me to do fox, about that #52 post, still can't really agree.
i have no wallhack installed to check when he would be able to see him coming, so i just think, you mean the 3 shots that NEARLY hit rage when he's jumping in from taht "door".
it's true, that these shots are very suprisingly close to rage, though i cannot see any of them hit him, but if its really an aimbot, it MUST have hit him ?
the ping wasnt that bad, rage was jumping that moment, an aimbot should have hit! at least one, but none of these plasmas hit . (at least i saw none)
then again, the crosshair actually goes strangely to the left, like you said, but its more likely to assume that satan thinks, the rail enemy jumps down to the side there, so he puts his Crosshair there. if you see that motion with timescale 0.1, you actually see the crosshair accelerating at the beginning of the motion, and getting slower at the end. i don't know if todays aimbots can do that. it's really a strange scene there, but since he is not hitting the shots on rage, and since the motion has an accerlation and is getting slower at the end, you can't really be sure that this is an aimbot or a wallhack. it's suspicous, but no proof.

plasma shots arent instant-hit my friend. :P

especially in doom3 (hint - 4mp/h)

the plasma in d3 was not a hit weapon. Just spam into the enemies direction and they've 10fps and then finish them with another weapon. Atleast thats the way I used it ( the week I played D3) :P

he has NO aimbot, you would immediately see if there was one or not. but it is highly likely that he used a different kind of cheat: an autoshoot thingie.

that means he ALWAYS aims for himself, that's why it's so hard to spot.
but when his crosshair is over an enemy (who doesn't even have to be visible yet -- it's enough if the outer border of the hit box appears), he will definately hit thanks to autoshoot. thus, rail and shotgun are as efficient as with a normal aimbot who aims for you. you often have the crosshair over the enemy, but you don't get the right time to click often. with autoshoot, you will hit, no matter what.

the problem is that an autoshooter is very inconspicious. you nearly don't notice it, because the aiming is done by himself. furthermore, he tries to hide it by doing these rail prediction shots often, which nearly no one does (because they are mostly pointless), so that you are fooled into thinking this would just be "his style" to rail quickly.

apart from that, his +wstat calls were quite noticeable... e.g. one was directly after storm disconnected temporarily. also, nearly everyone in the german q3 scene knows that satan has cheated in the past, so it's likely that he tries it again some time.

but i have to admit... you cannot say 100% if he cheated, but it's very likely. it would be easy to tell if he used a normal aimbot, but not here...
he's very good at hiding his cheating. he trained that. that's why he even was so self-confident telling storm that he can have the demo.

yeah, ur theory about the autoshoot sounds very plausible.

ok i may know fuck all about cheating, and satan may be a master at hiding it, but i tell you i think a 2v2 vs fox & tox would end way worse :)

And yes right, his crosshair jerks upward the exact nanosecond rage comes into sight, wich proves everything ! IC-Fox clearly knows this as he is a trained cheat spotter, and also pld q3 for a long time and what not.

Why cheat, cheater?

Strangest execution of the rail shot I have ever seen. Cold-blooded. Also his localization of the enemy is fucking flawless.

so sad

nice1 steve :)

Im curious wheter he tries to compensate his suspicious railaim with beeing a useless shafter/machinegunner or if he simply is that useless :)

comment #65
"an aimbot should have hit!"

aimbots still miss :), that cant account for ping perfectly and any bit of lag can make them miss, but u can see him hit shots where he cant see the enemy or know hes there but when he steps about 1cm out hes shot, total aimbot

hahhaha
this guy is a BIG joke...
man.. the shotgun skill is insane...
hope he never will start up quake3 again.

And it was not the first time he cheated..
A shame for the whole e-sport scene.
Leave it pls.

start up q3 again?
he never stopped it :P

It looks as if he has an autoshoot indeed, still I would not call this demo definate proof. As for the plasma burst, it is pretty legit but his aim did blatantly snap for when rage was coming through that door even though he was spaming for storm to drop.

I think it is best to notice the cheating whilst looking at the shotgun aim rather than the rail. Seems to be the same posistion in the hitbox a lot, over the left side of the model.

I fail to see how his aim was that much of a problem in this game though, 56% rail is totally feasable and only a few of the shots were "good" ones. Fair amount of easy air rails, shots where the players are moving in a straight line and when they are pressed against a wall. But I know nothing about tdm so I am missing the point likely.

They both got crap all of sudden and he refrained from using rail after storm complained, and again both were shite when GTV was connected so yeah that should be enough on its own.

Good work none the less.

Well he shot something like 20 rails into nothing so he would probably be closer to 70-75% and hit almost every target he pointed at in the first five minutes with the rail.

ive saw this type of 'aiming' before on a few players which i dont think i should name - when i pld on pickups me and some other fella questioned him about it and he made up some lame excuse no-one else questioned him afaik

i think its lame that people sometimes defend these people and ignore signs of cheating - well done storm/rage

CHEAT! WALLBOTHACKAIMLOL!!11 SATAN IS TEH N00B!

so fuckin obvious... how can he even think that's a normal way to aim and the most idiotic thing of all; HE SHARES THE FUCKIN DEMO! This guy is soo retarded...

thx storm, i'll finally be able to see a cheater demo, of a known player(not to me but i guess he is known around there), playing in a tourney. Material such as this might be pretty useful for the future too

*starts downloading* this should be good :P

update:

ok i watched the 2 parts and i am confident he cheats, blatantly too...

first i checked for the shots fox noticed, and i saw what he meant, sad :(

i also tried to spot some other stuff, i think i might be on to something with these:

around 3:10 : when he goes up the ra pad, he is ready all the way from the bottom to get the shot to the rail pad, the other player can not be heard due to the quad sound effects and all the other noices(like the pad sound).

around 13:05 : when he strafes from ra and arrives to rl there is a very slight time he appears to have a perfect lock on the other player, even at timescale 0.1 this seemed to happen during a very short period.

around 15:50 : when he drops down from pillars trying to finish off his opponent which is also falling on the other side of a pillar, he looked like he got a pretty good lock on his opponent from BEHIND the pillar and ended up seeing him when the line of sight restored.

and many times where he just got alot of rail shots in just... too fast... and he just knew ALL the time where his opponent was, only when storm stated his suspicion these started to happen alot less all of the sudden.

btw, ns at 17:59 from down ra storm :P

nice example of a cheat demo overall, i was trying to find one to do some personal research heh, maybe i am wrong, maybe right. Just my 50 cents in this post.

shame he wasn't called unborn huh?

why is it nobody asked the question of "why did satan himself send these telling demos to storm" yet?

because he probably thought he kept it will hidden, or because he knew it would be more suspect if he didnt send them.

you tried to answer the second 'why' and me the first one.. cool teamwork, asl?

I did ask that question.

Nobody understands your retarded essays.

Autoshoot on rail mostly :o

that was fucking perfect aiming or fucking good cheats or just fucking lucky day, but that SG & RG OMFG.

It's so obvious that even a blind man would spot it.

About that magic "omg he's shooting plasma from left to right just as rage enters the door at 5:3ish, that must be a wallhack"... well, no, it was more like luck and a coincidence.

As everyone can see watching the demo with r_shownormals 1 *, rage is not potentially visible until he is actually jumping out of the door so he could not have been spotted some time beforehand.
Now why satan enlarged his plasma spam pattern at that moment, I don't know. But it is not because rage was visible.
No aimbot snap either : it moves to the door and starts shooting from it to the right before rage is potentially visible.

We can see storm going for rail and shooting at someone, so it is likely that mao was on the other side and would have seen rage come and warned him on voice comms.
Still, this plasma spam can also be "in case storm jumps back down that way" (could be, after all storm is only periodically potentially visible at this point)

Now again, whether he knew rage was coming or not, no wallhack and therefore no aimbot snapping on that one
(* Wallhacks, just like freecaming in defrag or q3sdc don't see entities past the PVS which is exactly what we're seeing with shownormals)

As for the bobbing up "snapping" towards storm, it's quite obvious from these demos that satan has a fast sensitivity and trouble using it, and twitch plasma aim isn't uncommon, especially with this mousing criteria. Add leading to that and stair "imprecision" and this easily explains why some shots continue past storm's actual stopping point at the rail.

On the other hand, the first part of the demo has quite a few "pop inside my field of view and *bam*-instant rail" occurences which look quite obvious (wh and possibly autoshoot) even without r_shownormals 1.

2 cents

Besides, there is nothing else in the demo that implies that satan is using a regular aimbot.

I thought he was cheating.

I don't understand why people cheat in the first place... Can someone explain that too me, Satan maybe? ;)

I don't have any fun beating someone when it's with the help of a hack. It does not give a feeling of accomplisment. It must be people with very low self-respect, they feel the need to be respected by the online community or something... Unfortunately quite a lot of quake players are not so social/friendly :/ (hi forever).

Yeah I know. It's like my mate who always cheated in single player games because it was easier to beat it that way.

I don't understand why people whine like they do half the time either.

really is an ego problem most of the time, if they cheat and you lose move on you know you're better regardless, seriously who gives a fuck.

people just need excuses.

Yep, online ego = (real life ego)^3

Luckily, I don't care if I lose, especially nowadays when I play a game every couple of months and just look for a funny game against a friendly guy.

Do you realise that you're replying to a journal entry that dates back to 26 March 2005 right?

NO SHIT SHERLOCK

I doubt it was obvious to you before I pointed it out though, but I must admit that's a good save.

I told funnyb to actually bump more threads

I posted when this thread was first posted

the fact my new comment was a reply to another new comment, that come first (and another after that, oh wait then another but you still chose me to reply to, are you being that stupid?)

I think it's safe to say I knew how old this thread was.

All right, I see what you're saying. Sorry for assuming you didn't know how old the post was, I just didn't pay much attention to who I was replying to and after your reply I felt compelled to defend myself.

Luckily, I don't care if I lose

llllllllol that worth mentionin isit, nerd

Really funny to read most of the "old" comments here :)

Completely clueless about how cheats work, perhaps having an approximate idea or guessing, and a few actually know what they're talking about. But seriously, 2005? The general Q3 cheat knowledge looks like it's around four years behind f.e SoF2 (same engine, many of the same cheats) :D It was the same with the more recent Napalm3D deal too.

-----

If in doubt whether aimbots can be turned on and off at any time, whether the area on the enemy model it aims at can change to whatever at any time, whether they can predict or delay shots with any weapon, different values for each that can change at any time, whether it doesn't have to do a hard-lock Nightmare Xaero style but can do smooth subtle corrections instead, whether it is possible or not to (on the fly) change between manual and automatic operation with the latter possible to adjust exactly when it should kick in and not...

...whether autofire (or alternative name for the same thing) can be turned on and off at any time, whether you can still shoot manually when it is on, whether it can be used on all or only certain weapons, whether it can be given delay so that it doesn't fire the very frame it moves over the enemy, whether normal lag can make it miss even if it was intended to hit...

...whether wallhack can be turned on and off at any time, whether people can actually f****** pretend to be surprised even if they weren't because - omglolwtfbs - some of them actually want to get away with it, whether aimbots and autofires can be set (and changed at any time - individually for each weapon) to operate or not operate when players are actually behind walls, whether the PVS is incredibly important and if you know what the PVS is...

...whether ballhack (icon typically above players' heads) can be moved, changed to another harder to detect graphic than the normal triangle or whatever it is, turned on and off during the game manually or automatically at any intervals...

...whether there are lots more stuff like radars, detailed enemy info, screen-in-screens (like cpm's multipov stuff) that let you see more than just what is where you're currently looking and a whole bunch more stuff that I can't be arsed mentioning, that I just don't remember at the moment, and that I simply don't even know of, and whether pretty much all of these cheats can be combined in any fashion...

...whether PunkBuster fails to detect a lot of cheats, and whether people can feed it with all sorts of junk like custom GUIDs and screenshots instead of what it's supposed to get...


...if in doubt of any of this, just don't come and give opinions that sound like facts until you know for yourself that the answer to all of the above and much more is yes. It's alright to not know, but every time in a wallhack case some one says "but several times he DIDN'T know..." and everytime in an aimbot case some one says "dude, he missed several shots!", God kills a kitten. In fact, two.

And that's just an incredibly incomplete HALF of it. It's just what CHEATS can do. The other half is what people can and cannot do with all factors taken into account. One of these days when some random wannabe showoff points at a demo of a lightning gun snapping to an enemy and not leaving that exact spot on the hitbox, following every vertical and horizontal movement with frame perfection (that is; not tox-or-lugia-very-very-very good, but perfection), and begins the sentence "I can do that", "I see that stuff all the time here in our league/pickup games" or "It's nothing special..." - the entire kitten race may face the fate of the dinosaurs. God does not like that kind of stupidity and when God is angry, God smites.


Perhaps it's for the better though? Less general knowledge = less advanced cheats needed = less of the really "dangerous" coders who aren't just dumb kids but actually know their shit and like the challenge.


I apologize for any really stupid spelling, grammar or just plain logical error, I haven't slept since some day that wasn't today or yesterday and operate purely because there is likely not room for blood right now in my well-maintained caffeine circulatory system.

did i jamerio

did i jamerio

At minimum :)

Ok :( But I guess I can reuse it by linking to it every time in the future when people are murdering kittens x)

Links to demos are dead?